J
JohnSydney
Guest
Temp
ok ur right, i know nothing
ok ur right, i know nothing
J
JohnSydney
Guest
first of all, how did i complain about the Sydney Assyrian community? i trashed it completely? where? seperatist mates? i havent spread rumours about the bishop have i? i havent written articles against him or the church, i havent applauded a man who has been attacked have i? i referred to the church as 'shawa b'yarkha' cos i simply didnt want to bring the name of Mar Zaia into the story. as far as i know they celebrate on the 7th of jan right, our soorgada reads assyrian catholic church of the east, maybe im missing something here.....
ignorance la lol? come on, the only thing u have to go by is a copy or a real estate tender woteva it is, thats what u have, provided to u by someone who has been judged by the courts of australia for wrong doing. u support ppl like david chibo eena not the bishop la?
if u knew anything about me u would know im all for unification, im not one for this chaldoassyriansyriac name.
the fact remains that no matter what he has done in his private life, u cannot deny the fact that he and his fellow servants of God have built the church into what it is today in this country and yes it has been with the help of the community, but like i said, u dont know what the church is working on behind the scenes. its not ur business nor mine if he has had a physical relationship with that woman, its between him and God, we dont need ppl highlighting it or being happy about it. rebuke him for....? buying a house? none of us can say he slept with her or anything, its up to u to draw those conclusions if u could actually be bothered and have nothing better to do. ppl like u seem to be itching for someone like him to slip up so u can attack. thats just sad
Temp, ur stating the obvious, i dont need educating, i know very well there are beautiful churches in sydney, how? umm cos ive been to em and so has my family on a regualr basis.im fully aware of the goings on in our community let me tell u that
people havent liked mar meelis ever since he arrived here, and dont talk to me about before he got here, cos i was around i remember when he got here there was a massive split cos certain ppl didnt agree with his ideas, we all know the history. of course glory has to go to God, ive never called the bishop God khasli, but his ideas and work thru the community have built wot we have today, he has strength from God and thats why the churches are still packed to this day, rumours or not. when i say 'he' did this or 'him' obviously i dont mean singled handedly lol crying out loud, he has help u know. it his vision and ideas im talking about! ppl of the community actually know who the bishop is, they know the man himself thats why they love him, its a handful who r trying to ruin it.
Radrides, im beginning to like u, eena im not putting my brain with his/her trust me. he/she is speaking with alot of hate. thats the tone i picked up.my threats and statements? dude its the truth, why shay away from it. these things need to be addressed. is it ok for ppl to threat and attack mar bawai? of course not! i just want ppl to understand the facts and not jump to conclusions straight away esp when the man who made these allegations is nowhere to be seen! i aint going too far, plz dont take what im saying out of context. my point was that its ppl who dont actually attend our church that start rumours, hence ppl like that are not wanted in our church, they can attend other churches. if Temps blood boils cos of ppl who support the bishop, hama i have the right for my blood to boil at those who oppose him
lets just blame khaled for everything, easy way out la
ignorance la lol? come on, the only thing u have to go by is a copy or a real estate tender woteva it is, thats what u have, provided to u by someone who has been judged by the courts of australia for wrong doing. u support ppl like david chibo eena not the bishop la?
if u knew anything about me u would know im all for unification, im not one for this chaldoassyriansyriac name.
the fact remains that no matter what he has done in his private life, u cannot deny the fact that he and his fellow servants of God have built the church into what it is today in this country and yes it has been with the help of the community, but like i said, u dont know what the church is working on behind the scenes. its not ur business nor mine if he has had a physical relationship with that woman, its between him and God, we dont need ppl highlighting it or being happy about it. rebuke him for....? buying a house? none of us can say he slept with her or anything, its up to u to draw those conclusions if u could actually be bothered and have nothing better to do. ppl like u seem to be itching for someone like him to slip up so u can attack. thats just sad
Temp, ur stating the obvious, i dont need educating, i know very well there are beautiful churches in sydney, how? umm cos ive been to em and so has my family on a regualr basis.im fully aware of the goings on in our community let me tell u that
people havent liked mar meelis ever since he arrived here, and dont talk to me about before he got here, cos i was around i remember when he got here there was a massive split cos certain ppl didnt agree with his ideas, we all know the history. of course glory has to go to God, ive never called the bishop God khasli, but his ideas and work thru the community have built wot we have today, he has strength from God and thats why the churches are still packed to this day, rumours or not. when i say 'he' did this or 'him' obviously i dont mean singled handedly lol crying out loud, he has help u know. it his vision and ideas im talking about! ppl of the community actually know who the bishop is, they know the man himself thats why they love him, its a handful who r trying to ruin it.
Radrides, im beginning to like u, eena im not putting my brain with his/her trust me. he/she is speaking with alot of hate. thats the tone i picked up.my threats and statements? dude its the truth, why shay away from it. these things need to be addressed. is it ok for ppl to threat and attack mar bawai? of course not! i just want ppl to understand the facts and not jump to conclusions straight away esp when the man who made these allegations is nowhere to be seen! i aint going too far, plz dont take what im saying out of context. my point was that its ppl who dont actually attend our church that start rumours, hence ppl like that are not wanted in our church, they can attend other churches. if Temps blood boils cos of ppl who support the bishop, hama i have the right for my blood to boil at those who oppose him
lets just blame khaled for everything, easy way out la
Crocodile Bani
Well-known member
Temp, you should get a job as a stand up comedian
For all the people who have not lived in Australia, let me tell you some facts.
Before Mar Melis came to Sydney, the church (St Mary's in Fairfield heights) was used as a Gambling house and a party house. There was so much corruption in selecting the committee. All Mar Melis did was point out that drunken behaviour and gambling are not tolerated in a church. The morons looking after the church who were anti-Nineveh club declared Mar Melis is a Nineveh club patron.
Back in the early 80s (I think 1983), there were brawls all over Fairfield with AUA representitives trying to block some meeting taking place in Sydney. There were bashings, including my dear cousin. It was ugly. Brother fought against brother, families were split apart. Qasha Younan who was being backed at the time by the corrupt church committee made no comment about this mess.
TEMP, stop the lies. We as a community were in complete and utter disarray before Mar Meelis came. It was terrible and many families have not recovered from the scars of that conflict in 1983. How dare you lies and say that things were great before Mar Melis came. dare you to say it to all those who got bashed in the streets of Fairfield back in 1983.
DAGLANA!!!!!
For all the people who have not lived in Australia, let me tell you some facts.
Before Mar Melis came to Sydney, the church (St Mary's in Fairfield heights) was used as a Gambling house and a party house. There was so much corruption in selecting the committee. All Mar Melis did was point out that drunken behaviour and gambling are not tolerated in a church. The morons looking after the church who were anti-Nineveh club declared Mar Melis is a Nineveh club patron.
Back in the early 80s (I think 1983), there were brawls all over Fairfield with AUA representitives trying to block some meeting taking place in Sydney. There were bashings, including my dear cousin. It was ugly. Brother fought against brother, families were split apart. Qasha Younan who was being backed at the time by the corrupt church committee made no comment about this mess.
TEMP, stop the lies. We as a community were in complete and utter disarray before Mar Meelis came. It was terrible and many families have not recovered from the scars of that conflict in 1983. How dare you lies and say that things were great before Mar Melis came. dare you to say it to all those who got bashed in the streets of Fairfield back in 1983.
DAGLANA!!!!!
Temp,
Please understand that the point that Moja, John, Ninos, myself and others are making is that Zibla magazine is taking some limited information and making up rumours that are either misconceived or absolutely lacking in proof (funnily enough, it is in exactly the same maner as the 'logic' joke that Moja posted).
Zibla is preying on those that are naive to accept their ridiculous allegations as fact. As you know, Mar Meelis brought a defamation case in the NSW Supreme Court against David Chibo for the first publication relating to this issue and you must bear in mind that he exposed himself to the TRUTH being known on record in the Court of Law rather than an unscrupulous magazine in which he is not even given the courtesy of reviewing or responding to the allegations before they are published. Bear in mind that MAR MEELIS SUCCEEDED IN THE NSW SUPREME COURT.
Regardless of this, rather than reporting the Supreme Court decision or taking stock of the seriousness of their allegations, Zibla magazine came out and did a second round on Mar Meelis, and even declared Chibo "a hero". This time round however, Zibla did not even have the guts to print the name of the author of the article or the facts to prove the ridiculous conspiracy theories (such as the claim that he was having an affair). Again, this begs the question, which is more credible, the NSW Supreme Court or Zibla Magazine?
As for the purchase of the house with Eva, this happened many many years ago, and it certainly isn't some startling revelation of an affair. Eva is related to Mar Meelis (I think she is his cousin), and Mar Meelis simply assisted her with the purchase of the property. This does not mean that Mar Meelis is very rich, but certainly his personal backing of the purchase was required to assist Eva to purchase her house (I understand that Mar Meelis had been approached by Eva's ill parents at the time requesting that he assist her in his personal capacity). Regardless, Mar Meelis relinquished his share of the property a short time thereafter (and as Zibla reported for $1) and he has always lived in his current residence and certainly there has been no evidence whatsoever of an affair, either with Eva or with any other person for that matter of fact.
That is why it is incredibly disgusting to see Zibla magazine and others who try to defame Mar Meelis with utter unproven garbage, when he has spent his whole life preaching the word of God, the importance of preserving our nationality and heritage, and he has lived this by example for the entire time he has been the Bishop of Australia. Again, Mar Meelis has the success of the church to point to (and it cannot be denied that his leadership has been the true driving force behind this success) and the Supreme Court decision.
What Chibo and Zibla have done and continue to do serves no other purpose than to trash the names of our religious and political leaders, and they only support those that agree with their ideology (mainly Zawaa and anyone that supports that Chaldo-Assyrian name). This is not only ethically wrong, but legally wrong, incredibly shameful, and utterly sinful. For goodness sake, they do not adhere to even the most basic of journalistic ethics.
As for the comments about Shawaa B'yarkha, please remember that the Church of the East also succeeded when Shawaa B'yarkha took the dispute to the Supreme Court those many years ago. However, straight after that dispute, Shawaa B'yarkha were owing in excess of $300,000 to the Church of the East, but it was Mar Meelis who forgave that debt from the goodness of his heart. Since then, he has made relentless efforts to bring unity and harmony amongst the Church of the East and all the other denominations, and certainly all denominations should be given credit for this because at the end of the day we are bound by the fact that we are Assyrian. It is just a shame that some bad seeds (like the mob at Zibla) do not see it this way and continue to spread rumours that do not serve any other purpose than to bring the churches and political structures down.
As Moja put it, Zibla Magazine spins more crap than CNN and I for one have also boycotted the magazine.
Please understand that the point that Moja, John, Ninos, myself and others are making is that Zibla magazine is taking some limited information and making up rumours that are either misconceived or absolutely lacking in proof (funnily enough, it is in exactly the same maner as the 'logic' joke that Moja posted).
Zibla is preying on those that are naive to accept their ridiculous allegations as fact. As you know, Mar Meelis brought a defamation case in the NSW Supreme Court against David Chibo for the first publication relating to this issue and you must bear in mind that he exposed himself to the TRUTH being known on record in the Court of Law rather than an unscrupulous magazine in which he is not even given the courtesy of reviewing or responding to the allegations before they are published. Bear in mind that MAR MEELIS SUCCEEDED IN THE NSW SUPREME COURT.
Regardless of this, rather than reporting the Supreme Court decision or taking stock of the seriousness of their allegations, Zibla magazine came out and did a second round on Mar Meelis, and even declared Chibo "a hero". This time round however, Zibla did not even have the guts to print the name of the author of the article or the facts to prove the ridiculous conspiracy theories (such as the claim that he was having an affair). Again, this begs the question, which is more credible, the NSW Supreme Court or Zibla Magazine?
As for the purchase of the house with Eva, this happened many many years ago, and it certainly isn't some startling revelation of an affair. Eva is related to Mar Meelis (I think she is his cousin), and Mar Meelis simply assisted her with the purchase of the property. This does not mean that Mar Meelis is very rich, but certainly his personal backing of the purchase was required to assist Eva to purchase her house (I understand that Mar Meelis had been approached by Eva's ill parents at the time requesting that he assist her in his personal capacity). Regardless, Mar Meelis relinquished his share of the property a short time thereafter (and as Zibla reported for $1) and he has always lived in his current residence and certainly there has been no evidence whatsoever of an affair, either with Eva or with any other person for that matter of fact.
That is why it is incredibly disgusting to see Zibla magazine and others who try to defame Mar Meelis with utter unproven garbage, when he has spent his whole life preaching the word of God, the importance of preserving our nationality and heritage, and he has lived this by example for the entire time he has been the Bishop of Australia. Again, Mar Meelis has the success of the church to point to (and it cannot be denied that his leadership has been the true driving force behind this success) and the Supreme Court decision.
What Chibo and Zibla have done and continue to do serves no other purpose than to trash the names of our religious and political leaders, and they only support those that agree with their ideology (mainly Zawaa and anyone that supports that Chaldo-Assyrian name). This is not only ethically wrong, but legally wrong, incredibly shameful, and utterly sinful. For goodness sake, they do not adhere to even the most basic of journalistic ethics.
As for the comments about Shawaa B'yarkha, please remember that the Church of the East also succeeded when Shawaa B'yarkha took the dispute to the Supreme Court those many years ago. However, straight after that dispute, Shawaa B'yarkha were owing in excess of $300,000 to the Church of the East, but it was Mar Meelis who forgave that debt from the goodness of his heart. Since then, he has made relentless efforts to bring unity and harmony amongst the Church of the East and all the other denominations, and certainly all denominations should be given credit for this because at the end of the day we are bound by the fact that we are Assyrian. It is just a shame that some bad seeds (like the mob at Zibla) do not see it this way and continue to spread rumours that do not serve any other purpose than to bring the churches and political structures down.
As Moja put it, Zibla Magazine spins more crap than CNN and I for one have also boycotted the magazine.
John,
Your complaints about Sydney Assyrians are plastered all over this forum, I won?t bother. You?re a separatist because you referred to Showa b?yarkha as Orthodox. The official title of St. Zaia Cathedral is Ancient Holy Apostolic Catholic Church of the East. Celebrating Christmas on the 7th of January does not make one Orthodox!!! You didn?t want to bring the name of Mar Zaia into it? Who here has a tone of hatred? Yes?you were missing A LOT there! Both the churches are part of the Catholic dominion, only officially of course since our religion is not Catholic. Maybe when you attend ?all? these churches you should learn a little about them!
I don?t support David chibo or the bishop?I support my church, not it?s figure head or some guy writing for some magazine. I support the doctrines my church accepts. I accept their teachings.
The ?private? life of the churches figure-head IS the public?s responsibility as he is OUR representative. He gave up the right to have his private life be private when he took on his role. Great responsibility comes with his position. If you had it your way, our leaders could do whatever they wanted to do, break doctrines and vows and we just sit by and watch with our mouths closed. Doesn?t work that way, nor should it!
Rebuke him for the following?
Although purchasing a house with Eva does no prove he has had a physical relationship where he?s vow of chastity was broken. What it does prove is that his vow of poverty was broken. He?s got money that he vowed he wouldn?t have. It also proves that he either lived with the woman, which is what he signed to have done, constituting another wrong, or, alternatively, he lied and said he lived with her when he didn?t, again a wrong on his part! He cannot be proven to have had a physical relationship with her, but he did have an inappropriate relationship which resulted in a sin. Which sin, I don?t know, but a sin nonetheless.
His visions and ideas? So there are no other people within the church that had ideas about opening up a school and a retirement village? No one is trying to ruin any of these plans. The only thing people take issue with is the wrong that is being done and hidden. It?s the people who attend the churches who have problems with seeing its representative doing wrong. People who believe in the word of God and put THAT above any man!
I said it boils my blood when people talk about him like he?s God. He did this and he did that. What could he have done without God? STOP GIVING GLORY TO A MERE MAN!
MojaMoja
Aten'et douglana! The fights you?re referring to had NOTHING to do with the church committee. They were between a mixture of the political parties at the time (Khooyada and Bet Nahrain) and the clubs (Ninveh and Cultural). IN FACT the only place there WAS unity was the church! ALL Assyrians were members and socialised so don?t spread rubbish. The only ?disarray? was external to the church. And for your information, there was NEVER any gambling and drunken behaviour IN the church. There were Bingo games and alcohol at parties in the HALL!!! Much like there is in Edessa today. Why was Mar Meelis opposed to parties and alcohol in the church hall back in the day, which was FREE OF CHARGE, but today the same happens in Edessa FOR A FEE THAT GOES TO THE CHURCH! If it was dirty then, it?s dirty now, and that dirty money is gladly accepted by the church.
Rima,
As I mentioned in my reply to John, the issue of the affair is irrelevant. What was argued in Zinda is NOT what I am arguing here. My argument was that it was an inappropriate relationship. He should have NOT helped her out. Especially if she was a relative. He has a parish to look after, not specific family members. As I understand it, her father only became ill recently, not during the whole debacle, and what this has to do with any of this I don?t know. And him helping to purchase the house does not prove that he is rich., you?re right. Mind you I didn?t mention the property in Pyrmont. But the vow was not one of ?not being rich?. It was a vow of POVERTY! And having the means to help someone purchase a house does not classify him as poor. Therefore this vow was broken. In addition to that, he has claimed, in the eyes of the law, that he was living with his co-owner (i.e. Eva). If this is the truth he is doing wrong, if it is a lie he is committing a sin. See what inappropriate relationships lead to?
As far as I?m concerned, he did wrong, he made a bad decision which resulted in sin (i.e. lying) and should acknowledge it. If he truly believes what he represents, he should admit his wrong doings. And most importantly, people show ralise that he is just a man, a man prone to sin like the rest of us. Why people try and make out as if he?s infallible I?ll never understand.
About the $300 000. I have never heard of Showa b?yarkha having to pay $300 000 to the church which the bishop excused. However, what I do know about is the land that the church owned. 2 of the 5 Acers was agreed to have be sold to Cultural club, or Khooyada who ran it at the time, so that they could build a club. This was agreed to by the churches committee and Khooyada, all awaiting the bishop?s signature. He never signed, however, payments had already been made which the court ruled were to be paid back to Cultural club, with interest, and that the land be returned to the church.
Your complaints about Sydney Assyrians are plastered all over this forum, I won?t bother. You?re a separatist because you referred to Showa b?yarkha as Orthodox. The official title of St. Zaia Cathedral is Ancient Holy Apostolic Catholic Church of the East. Celebrating Christmas on the 7th of January does not make one Orthodox!!! You didn?t want to bring the name of Mar Zaia into it? Who here has a tone of hatred? Yes?you were missing A LOT there! Both the churches are part of the Catholic dominion, only officially of course since our religion is not Catholic. Maybe when you attend ?all? these churches you should learn a little about them!
I don?t support David chibo or the bishop?I support my church, not it?s figure head or some guy writing for some magazine. I support the doctrines my church accepts. I accept their teachings.
The ?private? life of the churches figure-head IS the public?s responsibility as he is OUR representative. He gave up the right to have his private life be private when he took on his role. Great responsibility comes with his position. If you had it your way, our leaders could do whatever they wanted to do, break doctrines and vows and we just sit by and watch with our mouths closed. Doesn?t work that way, nor should it!
Rebuke him for the following?
Although purchasing a house with Eva does no prove he has had a physical relationship where he?s vow of chastity was broken. What it does prove is that his vow of poverty was broken. He?s got money that he vowed he wouldn?t have. It also proves that he either lived with the woman, which is what he signed to have done, constituting another wrong, or, alternatively, he lied and said he lived with her when he didn?t, again a wrong on his part! He cannot be proven to have had a physical relationship with her, but he did have an inappropriate relationship which resulted in a sin. Which sin, I don?t know, but a sin nonetheless.
His visions and ideas? So there are no other people within the church that had ideas about opening up a school and a retirement village? No one is trying to ruin any of these plans. The only thing people take issue with is the wrong that is being done and hidden. It?s the people who attend the churches who have problems with seeing its representative doing wrong. People who believe in the word of God and put THAT above any man!
I said it boils my blood when people talk about him like he?s God. He did this and he did that. What could he have done without God? STOP GIVING GLORY TO A MERE MAN!
MojaMoja
Aten'et douglana! The fights you?re referring to had NOTHING to do with the church committee. They were between a mixture of the political parties at the time (Khooyada and Bet Nahrain) and the clubs (Ninveh and Cultural). IN FACT the only place there WAS unity was the church! ALL Assyrians were members and socialised so don?t spread rubbish. The only ?disarray? was external to the church. And for your information, there was NEVER any gambling and drunken behaviour IN the church. There were Bingo games and alcohol at parties in the HALL!!! Much like there is in Edessa today. Why was Mar Meelis opposed to parties and alcohol in the church hall back in the day, which was FREE OF CHARGE, but today the same happens in Edessa FOR A FEE THAT GOES TO THE CHURCH! If it was dirty then, it?s dirty now, and that dirty money is gladly accepted by the church.
Rima,
As I mentioned in my reply to John, the issue of the affair is irrelevant. What was argued in Zinda is NOT what I am arguing here. My argument was that it was an inappropriate relationship. He should have NOT helped her out. Especially if she was a relative. He has a parish to look after, not specific family members. As I understand it, her father only became ill recently, not during the whole debacle, and what this has to do with any of this I don?t know. And him helping to purchase the house does not prove that he is rich., you?re right. Mind you I didn?t mention the property in Pyrmont. But the vow was not one of ?not being rich?. It was a vow of POVERTY! And having the means to help someone purchase a house does not classify him as poor. Therefore this vow was broken. In addition to that, he has claimed, in the eyes of the law, that he was living with his co-owner (i.e. Eva). If this is the truth he is doing wrong, if it is a lie he is committing a sin. See what inappropriate relationships lead to?
As far as I?m concerned, he did wrong, he made a bad decision which resulted in sin (i.e. lying) and should acknowledge it. If he truly believes what he represents, he should admit his wrong doings. And most importantly, people show ralise that he is just a man, a man prone to sin like the rest of us. Why people try and make out as if he?s infallible I?ll never understand.
About the $300 000. I have never heard of Showa b?yarkha having to pay $300 000 to the church which the bishop excused. However, what I do know about is the land that the church owned. 2 of the 5 Acers was agreed to have be sold to Cultural club, or Khooyada who ran it at the time, so that they could build a club. This was agreed to by the churches committee and Khooyada, all awaiting the bishop?s signature. He never signed, however, payments had already been made which the court ruled were to be paid back to Cultural club, with interest, and that the land be returned to the church.
JohnSydney said:
John,
Encouraging people to voice their opinions if they see something wrong has nothing to do with which church ones goes to. I for one have been to all 3 churches, yet I still believe that the bishop is not worthy of being where he is today.
I'm not suggesting that he had a relationship with this woman, as I do not have a proof of that, but what I do know that he had no business buying a house with this woman.
It's also not right to confuse the Church with the bishop and look at them as one, people who don't approve of the bishop's actions are not necessarily haters of the church. The bishop is only a servant of the church, people like him come and go, to have an issue with one of them doesn't mean one hates the church.
As Temp already said, what has been done here is mainly because of the community. Sydney witnessed the biggest growth in the number of Assyrians worldwide after 1990, and I would say the people who have arrived in the past 15 years have a higher percentage of church goers than the ones who were born here, therefore a higher church attendance, a higher income for the church, leading to more money to use in doing stuff for the community. You're making it sound as if the bishop put his hand in his pocket and paid for all these projects himself.
I do not deny that the bishop has managed to build a school, but as I said many times before, one shouldn't disregard everything simply because he has done some good deeds. Every action should be judged on its own merit, he does well, we should appreciate it, he slips, we should question it, exactly like any other leader.
As for him being more intelligent than all of us put together, I highly doubt that. If he was half as intelligent as you claim, he would've not gotton involved with crooks such as Khaled and his gang.
Regarding the unity among Assyrians in Australia, he has done as much for unity as Saddam did for world peace.
Judging him on what we see with our own eyes!!! Makes sense, everyone saw his ignorant and reckless comment on TV during the 1987 saga, everyone have access to the see the court proceedings of Khaled's asset liquidation/Daily Telegraphs/Australian Financial Review, and the bishop's name is mentioned several times, everyone can see the documents in this recent article showing his involvement in things he shouldn't have gone near.
And what does "Mar Bawai" has to done with anything!!! Mar Bawai is an educated and respectable person, so you cannot mix apples with organes, the issues against Mar Bawai are supported within the church by none other than Mar Meelis himself, together with Mar Narsai and Mar Dinkha. Mar Meelis have stated his opposition to Mar Bawai in a televised interview, do you think THAT was appropriate?
The rise in Mar Bawai's popularity due to his knowledge and good personality worried some people, such as Mar Meelis who isn't at the same level as Mar Bawai (religious education wise) but is undoubtly the head of the richest congragation, and therefore is quite powerful.
There definitely is a plot by some community leaders, supported by certain church leaders to stop Mar Bawai. I hope it doesn't happen.
Ps, I've just started with John's reply and I'll make my way through the posts and reply to them, many more replies to come.
RadRides said:
RadRides said:
I totally agree with your comments regarding Mar Bawai, he's one of the very few decent people we have in the church.
I've watched his interview on TV and everything he said in it made sense, I really admired his speech.
Splits are not caused by people, they've always been caused by church leaders, and if it happens again now "god forbid", it'll be the church leaders again.
There is way too much politics in our church these days, being the 25th or the 7th, and this saga of Mar Bawai is just the latest example of that.
If someone like Mar Meelis succeeds in using his money & power to stop a good person like Mar Bawai, then we're seriously doomed.
sydneydude
New member
senalko im gonna start a new topic in the religous forums about traditions...lets discuss it there and leave the church politics to this post (they are two major different issues)
ive been meaning to add my thoughts on ur views on our "traditions"...
ive been meaning to add my thoughts on ur views on our "traditions"...
J
JohnSydney
Guest
Temp and Salem, u guys r right i take back everything i said obviously i dont know anything. only im the one taking things too far la? jareh even the bishop isnt allowed to sin according to u guys
You can address ur complaints n problems to:
His Grace Bishop Mar Meelis Zaia
Diocese Bishop
bishop@assyrianchurch.com.au
rebuke him there all u want, instead were sit here on an internet forum and talking about dead issues, all i did was show what zinda published lets remember that.
You can address ur complaints n problems to:
His Grace Bishop Mar Meelis Zaia
Diocese Bishop
bishop@assyrianchurch.com.au
rebuke him there all u want, instead were sit here on an internet forum and talking about dead issues, all i did was show what zinda published lets remember that.
John,
The discussion we're having here is what the forums are meant for, exchanging opinions regarding a specific issue. If everyone says, I don't know anything, go tell your opinion to such and such, there wont be any purpose for a forum.
I did not say that you don?t know anything, nor did I say that he's not allowed to sin, only the fact that he should acknowledge his mistakes, as is the case with any other leader when he/she makes a mistake.
I hope you didn't take my post to heart as it was not a personal attack on you, but merely a disagreement with your views.
The discussion we're having here is what the forums are meant for, exchanging opinions regarding a specific issue. If everyone says, I don't know anything, go tell your opinion to such and such, there wont be any purpose for a forum.
I did not say that you don?t know anything, nor did I say that he's not allowed to sin, only the fact that he should acknowledge his mistakes, as is the case with any other leader when he/she makes a mistake.
I hope you didn't take my post to heart as it was not a personal attack on you, but merely a disagreement with your views.
J
JohnSydney
Guest
dude i dont take things personally believe me. the sad thing is that ppl are still talking about mar meelis actions. i thought these things were all finished. i pasted zindas article thats all. i didnt wanna get into this arguement about the bishop. im not against anyone here or any church.
assyrians gota learn, if anyone has a problem with the church, approach them. its our church for crying out loud, theyre not gona tell u to piss off, eena we have some ppl who sit here and address their problems and it goes overboard cos were all passionate about something.this is a sensitive issue and ppl will take it to heart, or as Temp said, their blood will boil
im old enough and mature enough to understand every sides story, cos i only see the facts and give credit where its due, eena some of the things Temp has said are just a joke, even accusing me of infesting these forums with negative comments about my ppl! it might seem i come across as hard or angry but im not, i cnt understand y were not trying to be together and work together.
this wont end anyways
assyrians gota learn, if anyone has a problem with the church, approach them. its our church for crying out loud, theyre not gona tell u to piss off, eena we have some ppl who sit here and address their problems and it goes overboard cos were all passionate about something.this is a sensitive issue and ppl will take it to heart, or as Temp said, their blood will boil
im old enough and mature enough to understand every sides story, cos i only see the facts and give credit where its due, eena some of the things Temp has said are just a joke, even accusing me of infesting these forums with negative comments about my ppl! it might seem i come across as hard or angry but im not, i cnt understand y were not trying to be together and work together.
this wont end anyways
No body in this post said they have a problem with the church. The problem they have is in relation to Mar Meelis and his actions. As Salem said, the point of these forums are to discuss. These issues HAVE been taken up with Mar Meelis himself. Don't sit there and tell me "If you knew what I was involved with" blah blah blah. GOOD!!! More people should get involved. If your patriotic then be it constantly, don't throw your words around carelessly. Your quite happy to acknowledge the problems we have on the streets but try and help cover up or ignore the one's we have in our churches. It's ridiculous.
And why do you keep mentioning Mar Bawi? Why are you associating these two men? They are nothing alike. In fact Mar Meelis is opposed to Mar Bawi and his actions in this regard has been appalling. He's trying to unify the churches? Ridiculous!
And why do you keep mentioning Mar Bawi? Why are you associating these two men? They are nothing alike. In fact Mar Meelis is opposed to Mar Bawi and his actions in this regard has been appalling. He's trying to unify the churches? Ridiculous!
J
JohnSydney
Guest
lol ok
i cant remember where i said mar meelis was innocent, i did say however that these allegations didnt hold up in court, so y cant we accept that? ur only arguement is his actions lol yet u ignore the good things his done? im not ignoring the churches problems, church is still packed, ill still go to church with or without mar meelis.ive constantly said i dont care what his done in his own time, his not my dad, i dont go to his church, its for Jesus at least u and i can agree on that
as for mar bawai yani im just repeating myself. i knowwwwwww mar meelis is opposed to him. my point as i told u, is that both men are trying to do something 'positive' in their eyes and have met opposition from their own ppl.thats how i see them as similar, can u c that?
lol temp seriously have i said anything right at all in this topic? apprently not as im careless and tend to throw my words around
i cant remember where i said mar meelis was innocent, i did say however that these allegations didnt hold up in court, so y cant we accept that? ur only arguement is his actions lol yet u ignore the good things his done? im not ignoring the churches problems, church is still packed, ill still go to church with or without mar meelis.ive constantly said i dont care what his done in his own time, his not my dad, i dont go to his church, its for Jesus at least u and i can agree on that
as for mar bawai yani im just repeating myself. i knowwwwwww mar meelis is opposed to him. my point as i told u, is that both men are trying to do something 'positive' in their eyes and have met opposition from their own ppl.thats how i see them as similar, can u c that?
lol temp seriously have i said anything right at all in this topic? apprently not as im careless and tend to throw my words around
J
JohnSydney
Guest
Temp,
aziza/azista khayet libbi, my last post on this topic will be this:
just read what Rima said to u above, thats all
hallo pshena
aziza/azista khayet libbi, my last post on this topic will be this:
just read what Rima said to u above, thats all
hallo pshena
Well, to JohnSydney - John Isaac, "Rima" - John Isaac, Moja Moja - Bani Pera, SydneyGuy - Peter Esho and all the others who have been blind folded, I say the following:
1. John Sydney, we all know you are "Rima", so stop trying to give yourself credibility by referring to your own posts.
2. Peter Esho, it's interesting to see that whilst you have the conniving hide to be an "informant" to your buddy John Isaac, yet you have not made a comment on the Zinda article. Is it because you find yourself in a dilemma as you are now faced with irrefutable facts AND evidence? Also, you fear that if you speak up in so called defence of Mar Meelis, you may be seen as going against your own uncle, Mar Bawai Soro? In particular, JOhnSydney/Rima, you actually say that you know Mar Meelis is against Mar Bawai. Forgive me for asking, but isin't that, in itself, against what Jesus preaches? Hmmmm...interesting situation you are now placed in...I feel for you Peter/SydneyGuy, truly.
3. Let's get some things straight and let me shed some light. It is obvious that JohnSydney doesn't understand the nature of all the material supporting the Article. You refer to it as a real estate tender or something - just goes to show your ignorance. That's ok, its no fault on your part. I'm sure many people find themselves in the position where they can't really understand the nature of the documents. I agree, most of them use technical jargon.
4. Firstly, the article is by Zinda. So why are you getting Chibo into it again? If you talk about backing up what people say, then back that one up. I don't know who is this Chibo guy is (assuming, of course, that it is a guy) but, I gotta say, I admire his efforts. He is a MAN, rightly said by you. It has been a rare occurence for a real MAN to stand up and voice what people have thought all these years. And I have been reassured that there are still people in our beloved community who can see this.
5. You carry on, sorry, "Rima" does, that the Court has spoken etc etc. Well, if you bother to not just read the decision but actually understand it, you will see that Mar Meelis' "win" was on a "technicality". That being, because Chibo wasn't at court, Mar Meelis and his so called independent "witnesses" were given free rope to say what they want without being challenged or cross-questioned. How interesting that Qasha Genard was a witness...of course...I need not say more on him, but I wonder why Qashar Ashur wasn't a witness??? Let's not go there. Oh, and Ilbra Yagoupour, what would she know? Her dad is in the church committee so that's why she got involved.
Anyway, I think its great that Chibo didn't rock up to Court. Why should he. Only God can Judge him. I don't believe in the Courts on earth. That's where my religious beliefs are. Anyway, why wouldn't Mar Meelis sue? or sue again? he has the church's (OUR) money at his Fingertips. He can hire the best lawyers there are and spend all that he wants. We all know the power of money and the injustice that can result.
I think the whole court case was pointless. It's important to compare: when the late Pope John Paul II was almost assassinated, he personally went and visited his would be assassinator in prison and forgave him. Hmmmm.....whatever happened to forgiveness? Or are we too busy now trying to get more and more money? Hmmm....that's a good idea, I'll sue Chibo, Zinda and get money which I will tell everyone will go to the church but hey, then again, it could really help me reduce my mortgage on my beautiful Pyrmont apartment.....now that's an idea.
Oh, hang on a minute, I've heard those words before "I will give the money back". Yes, that's right, that's what he said about the money Karl gave to the church. And, Moja Moja, don't sit there in Japan and talk about things you know nothing about. I don't care what your mum has to say about her church attendances. That is not fact. You want facts and dont believe Zinda, well, call the liquidator and check. I'm sure he will assist you...after all, that's what he's getting paid for. You shoudl know that. I must say Bani, I expected better from you....
6. Oh, and that brings me to the issue of the David Zaia stuff with Karl that Zinda reported about. Why don't you say anything about that huh? Its all there. Property dealings with the Jews, investment contract with Karl etc etc. What more do you want? Of course, you will say everything is docted, as that suits your purpose. But again, if in doubt, just call the liquidator. You, JohnSydney, aren't the only one who can tell people to email the Bishop to clarify things or whatever. Actually, I encourage people to do their own research before airing opinions; that way, at least what you have to say will mean something, as it can be taken constructively.
7. John, You say Chibo has no right to all that stuff. I don't see anywhere in the article that those stuff are Chibos. Anyway, and again, I excuse your ignorance, all that "stuff" up on Zinda, can be checked. AND they are publicly available documents; there is nothing secret about them. Johnsydney, if you had SOWDA, you yourself could even get a copy for yourself from the relevant government departments. Oh, hang on, that would then make you educated and then make your opinions count; to some extent at least.
8. It bothers me when I see a few youth (I don't mean Moja Moja Bani Pera as I would expect more from him, given his age) but anyway, we are all not perfect, and that includes me. But, it bothers me when some youth trhink they have all the right information when most, if not all, the stuff they "know" is based on what their parents told them. Peter and John, you guys would have barely been teens when the rift in church happened. So again, most, if not all, of your "information" or "facts" are based on what you heard as little boys from your parents or relatives. Its only now, as you "grow up", and I use that word loosely, do you begin to think about these things. But unfortunately, there is a lot you just don't know. Again, for no fault of your own.
9. John, you came on yesterday or whenever with a very threatening tone. No doubt, Salem, as administrator, you are aware of that and its consequences, but I will leave that to you, as I actually respect you Salem, as you were MAN enough to have raised this whole Church issue early on. Bravo. Glad to see another MAN in this community. Like I said, REAL MEN are rare these days, just look at when the whole Khalid thing happened; every Assyrian male wanted to get his revenge at Karl and swore on whosever's head that they would "get him." I am not, for one second, encouraging violence, but hey, Khalid is still roaming free, so many years later.
10. What "Rima" doesn't realise is just as "she" quickly reported the court case and mentioned that Salem had referred to the article in his earlier posts, John, you have done the same thing by putting the link to Zinda up this time round. If you don't watch your self, you could also be sued by the Bishop for distributing defamatory material! (if, of course, it is defamatory). Didn't think of that one now did you? That's ok, you're forgiven...again.
11. Oh, just as a side note, all my speaking of "forgiveness" in this post is not, by any means, meant to be sarcastic or ironic......(you can read into that one).
12. John and others, you mention Eva is about to wed. Yes, I know, in January to an Australian, wedding at Rushcutters Bay and she will be living in beautiful Balmain. What you don't realise is the article doesn't say when the so called relationship happened, so why do you assume it happened recently? Actually, the article doesn't even say there was an "affair". Furthermore, as I recall, Moja Moja, you also expressed a "rumour" that you had heard such a similar thing...well, you better watch yourself to, that you don't find a law suit at your Japanese doorstep.
13. Why do you choose to ignore the shareholdings? Oh, of course, you will say the Bishop is allowed to own things and we are not allowed to get involved in his personal life. Well, that's where you are wrong buddy. Again, your views are misconstrued, but, again, no fault of your own. Peter, you are "religious" apparently, so you should know this. If you don't, go ask your parents...again, no sarcasm intended.
The church of the East believes that a bishop is enshrined with the Holy Spirit. Mar Meelis is a "representative" of the Holy Spirit on Earth. The Holy Spirit is, of course, Christ. As others have rightly said, there is no private/personal life. There is one thing only and that is preaching the word of Christ and following his footsteps. So, why then, does he feel he needs a beautiful city apartment? Or conduct business from the Cecill Hills Church property...I'm talking about GTZ Trading Pty Ltd and his 9000 shares. The last I heard, GTZ was a meat export business...anf Bishops aren't allowed to eat meat.
Who can afford a AUD $700,000 mortgage these days? I know me and my wife can't. Well, I hope His Grace will invite us over one day..I'ld love to sit on that balcony and take in the beautiful views. Maybe I can confess to him there?
14. Maybe Mar Meelis wasn't involved in that way with Eva. We may never know. But again, it begs the question, why did he decide to co-own the land with her jointly and not the other way? If he was "helping" her, well, he really did "help" her, when he transferred his half share in the land to her for basically nothing. Oh, but he has a mortgage with her too. Did you bother to look at that. Again, a publicly available document that you check out for yourselves, all you non-believers.
I could go on forever, but I won't. Just wake up guys. Open your eyes....widely.
Blessings.
PS Unlike JohnSydney, I welcome your comments and opinion. After all, we are all entitled to one.
1. John Sydney, we all know you are "Rima", so stop trying to give yourself credibility by referring to your own posts.
2. Peter Esho, it's interesting to see that whilst you have the conniving hide to be an "informant" to your buddy John Isaac, yet you have not made a comment on the Zinda article. Is it because you find yourself in a dilemma as you are now faced with irrefutable facts AND evidence? Also, you fear that if you speak up in so called defence of Mar Meelis, you may be seen as going against your own uncle, Mar Bawai Soro? In particular, JOhnSydney/Rima, you actually say that you know Mar Meelis is against Mar Bawai. Forgive me for asking, but isin't that, in itself, against what Jesus preaches? Hmmmm...interesting situation you are now placed in...I feel for you Peter/SydneyGuy, truly.
3. Let's get some things straight and let me shed some light. It is obvious that JohnSydney doesn't understand the nature of all the material supporting the Article. You refer to it as a real estate tender or something - just goes to show your ignorance. That's ok, its no fault on your part. I'm sure many people find themselves in the position where they can't really understand the nature of the documents. I agree, most of them use technical jargon.
4. Firstly, the article is by Zinda. So why are you getting Chibo into it again? If you talk about backing up what people say, then back that one up. I don't know who is this Chibo guy is (assuming, of course, that it is a guy) but, I gotta say, I admire his efforts. He is a MAN, rightly said by you. It has been a rare occurence for a real MAN to stand up and voice what people have thought all these years. And I have been reassured that there are still people in our beloved community who can see this.
5. You carry on, sorry, "Rima" does, that the Court has spoken etc etc. Well, if you bother to not just read the decision but actually understand it, you will see that Mar Meelis' "win" was on a "technicality". That being, because Chibo wasn't at court, Mar Meelis and his so called independent "witnesses" were given free rope to say what they want without being challenged or cross-questioned. How interesting that Qasha Genard was a witness...of course...I need not say more on him, but I wonder why Qashar Ashur wasn't a witness??? Let's not go there. Oh, and Ilbra Yagoupour, what would she know? Her dad is in the church committee so that's why she got involved.
Anyway, I think its great that Chibo didn't rock up to Court. Why should he. Only God can Judge him. I don't believe in the Courts on earth. That's where my religious beliefs are. Anyway, why wouldn't Mar Meelis sue? or sue again? he has the church's (OUR) money at his Fingertips. He can hire the best lawyers there are and spend all that he wants. We all know the power of money and the injustice that can result.
I think the whole court case was pointless. It's important to compare: when the late Pope John Paul II was almost assassinated, he personally went and visited his would be assassinator in prison and forgave him. Hmmmm.....whatever happened to forgiveness? Or are we too busy now trying to get more and more money? Hmmm....that's a good idea, I'll sue Chibo, Zinda and get money which I will tell everyone will go to the church but hey, then again, it could really help me reduce my mortgage on my beautiful Pyrmont apartment.....now that's an idea.
Oh, hang on a minute, I've heard those words before "I will give the money back". Yes, that's right, that's what he said about the money Karl gave to the church. And, Moja Moja, don't sit there in Japan and talk about things you know nothing about. I don't care what your mum has to say about her church attendances. That is not fact. You want facts and dont believe Zinda, well, call the liquidator and check. I'm sure he will assist you...after all, that's what he's getting paid for. You shoudl know that. I must say Bani, I expected better from you....
6. Oh, and that brings me to the issue of the David Zaia stuff with Karl that Zinda reported about. Why don't you say anything about that huh? Its all there. Property dealings with the Jews, investment contract with Karl etc etc. What more do you want? Of course, you will say everything is docted, as that suits your purpose. But again, if in doubt, just call the liquidator. You, JohnSydney, aren't the only one who can tell people to email the Bishop to clarify things or whatever. Actually, I encourage people to do their own research before airing opinions; that way, at least what you have to say will mean something, as it can be taken constructively.
7. John, You say Chibo has no right to all that stuff. I don't see anywhere in the article that those stuff are Chibos. Anyway, and again, I excuse your ignorance, all that "stuff" up on Zinda, can be checked. AND they are publicly available documents; there is nothing secret about them. Johnsydney, if you had SOWDA, you yourself could even get a copy for yourself from the relevant government departments. Oh, hang on, that would then make you educated and then make your opinions count; to some extent at least.
8. It bothers me when I see a few youth (I don't mean Moja Moja Bani Pera as I would expect more from him, given his age) but anyway, we are all not perfect, and that includes me. But, it bothers me when some youth trhink they have all the right information when most, if not all, the stuff they "know" is based on what their parents told them. Peter and John, you guys would have barely been teens when the rift in church happened. So again, most, if not all, of your "information" or "facts" are based on what you heard as little boys from your parents or relatives. Its only now, as you "grow up", and I use that word loosely, do you begin to think about these things. But unfortunately, there is a lot you just don't know. Again, for no fault of your own.
9. John, you came on yesterday or whenever with a very threatening tone. No doubt, Salem, as administrator, you are aware of that and its consequences, but I will leave that to you, as I actually respect you Salem, as you were MAN enough to have raised this whole Church issue early on. Bravo. Glad to see another MAN in this community. Like I said, REAL MEN are rare these days, just look at when the whole Khalid thing happened; every Assyrian male wanted to get his revenge at Karl and swore on whosever's head that they would "get him." I am not, for one second, encouraging violence, but hey, Khalid is still roaming free, so many years later.
10. What "Rima" doesn't realise is just as "she" quickly reported the court case and mentioned that Salem had referred to the article in his earlier posts, John, you have done the same thing by putting the link to Zinda up this time round. If you don't watch your self, you could also be sued by the Bishop for distributing defamatory material! (if, of course, it is defamatory). Didn't think of that one now did you? That's ok, you're forgiven...again.
11. Oh, just as a side note, all my speaking of "forgiveness" in this post is not, by any means, meant to be sarcastic or ironic......(you can read into that one).
12. John and others, you mention Eva is about to wed. Yes, I know, in January to an Australian, wedding at Rushcutters Bay and she will be living in beautiful Balmain. What you don't realise is the article doesn't say when the so called relationship happened, so why do you assume it happened recently? Actually, the article doesn't even say there was an "affair". Furthermore, as I recall, Moja Moja, you also expressed a "rumour" that you had heard such a similar thing...well, you better watch yourself to, that you don't find a law suit at your Japanese doorstep.
13. Why do you choose to ignore the shareholdings? Oh, of course, you will say the Bishop is allowed to own things and we are not allowed to get involved in his personal life. Well, that's where you are wrong buddy. Again, your views are misconstrued, but, again, no fault of your own. Peter, you are "religious" apparently, so you should know this. If you don't, go ask your parents...again, no sarcasm intended.
The church of the East believes that a bishop is enshrined with the Holy Spirit. Mar Meelis is a "representative" of the Holy Spirit on Earth. The Holy Spirit is, of course, Christ. As others have rightly said, there is no private/personal life. There is one thing only and that is preaching the word of Christ and following his footsteps. So, why then, does he feel he needs a beautiful city apartment? Or conduct business from the Cecill Hills Church property...I'm talking about GTZ Trading Pty Ltd and his 9000 shares. The last I heard, GTZ was a meat export business...anf Bishops aren't allowed to eat meat.
Who can afford a AUD $700,000 mortgage these days? I know me and my wife can't. Well, I hope His Grace will invite us over one day..I'ld love to sit on that balcony and take in the beautiful views. Maybe I can confess to him there?
14. Maybe Mar Meelis wasn't involved in that way with Eva. We may never know. But again, it begs the question, why did he decide to co-own the land with her jointly and not the other way? If he was "helping" her, well, he really did "help" her, when he transferred his half share in the land to her for basically nothing. Oh, but he has a mortgage with her too. Did you bother to look at that. Again, a publicly available document that you check out for yourselves, all you non-believers.
I could go on forever, but I won't. Just wake up guys. Open your eyes....widely.
Blessings.
PS Unlike JohnSydney, I welcome your comments and opinion. After all, we are all entitled to one.
sydneydude
New member
simqat,
in response to your comments:
1. for starters, im not an informant to anybody. i dont need to inform anybody with information that is widely known within the public arena and is made available for online use through zinda. john isn't an idiot, he is a very smart guy and can find things out for himself. please do not make unsubstantiated accusations.
2. i dont need to comment on this issue because it doesnt affect me, my family nor my uncle. it is others who have brought mar bawai into this post...the zinda article doesnt make any reference to mar bawai or my family. therefore i dont need to waste my time posting things that i wish not to get into
3. my family relationship is my own business. the relationship between me and my uncle is for ourselves, i dont need to prove it to you or anybody else. i suggest you concentrate on your own family and dont worrie about whats going on in others (whether its mine or bani pera's). its non of your business.
4. your assuming im going to speak in defence of mar meelis...where did you derive this assumption from ??? is there something/someone that would give you the impression im going to defend him or are you trying to tempt me to make a comment i shouldnt make...the devil tried to tempt Christ, but Christ stood firm and didnt give in (Mathew Chapter 4...maybe you should read this sometime...you might find it interesting)
5. im not religous, im a Christian. there is a difference...again, my faith is my own business. i dont appreciate you having to make it a public discussion.
6. you seem to know a lot about our identities, the church and the KSE incident. im assuming your somebody we all know very well, maybe even a distant relative. why is it that you need to use this forum to make your views heard ? could you not have approached me in private the next time you saw me ? or even have emailed me these very questions.
again, i dont appreciate the fact that your have brought my family relationship into this post. their not related...it hurts to have to come to work and read this in the morning and then post something in order to justify myself and my family's stand.
you dont feel for me, you couldnt really care...please dont say that. if you valued my feelings, you would have given me the respect i deserved.
i dont appreciate my name and my family's dilema being made into a public farce.
in conclusion...you have shed many names in your post except that of your own. is that because you wish to remain anonymous ? is it fair for you to identify each one of us (with surnames) but to hide behind your "simqat" screen name
....please do speak up! im sure you got nothing to hide. u joined the forums online a few days ago and this is your second post, seems to me you couldnt hold yourself ...is it because you are so hurt with the Chebo decision that you couldnt help hold it any longer ?
in response to your comments:
1. for starters, im not an informant to anybody. i dont need to inform anybody with information that is widely known within the public arena and is made available for online use through zinda. john isn't an idiot, he is a very smart guy and can find things out for himself. please do not make unsubstantiated accusations.
2. i dont need to comment on this issue because it doesnt affect me, my family nor my uncle. it is others who have brought mar bawai into this post...the zinda article doesnt make any reference to mar bawai or my family. therefore i dont need to waste my time posting things that i wish not to get into
3. my family relationship is my own business. the relationship between me and my uncle is for ourselves, i dont need to prove it to you or anybody else. i suggest you concentrate on your own family and dont worrie about whats going on in others (whether its mine or bani pera's). its non of your business.
4. your assuming im going to speak in defence of mar meelis...where did you derive this assumption from ??? is there something/someone that would give you the impression im going to defend him or are you trying to tempt me to make a comment i shouldnt make...the devil tried to tempt Christ, but Christ stood firm and didnt give in (Mathew Chapter 4...maybe you should read this sometime...you might find it interesting)
5. im not religous, im a Christian. there is a difference...again, my faith is my own business. i dont appreciate you having to make it a public discussion.
6. you seem to know a lot about our identities, the church and the KSE incident. im assuming your somebody we all know very well, maybe even a distant relative. why is it that you need to use this forum to make your views heard ? could you not have approached me in private the next time you saw me ? or even have emailed me these very questions.
again, i dont appreciate the fact that your have brought my family relationship into this post. their not related...it hurts to have to come to work and read this in the morning and then post something in order to justify myself and my family's stand.
you dont feel for me, you couldnt really care...please dont say that. if you valued my feelings, you would have given me the respect i deserved.
i dont appreciate my name and my family's dilema being made into a public farce.
in conclusion...you have shed many names in your post except that of your own. is that because you wish to remain anonymous ? is it fair for you to identify each one of us (with surnames) but to hide behind your "simqat" screen name
....please do speak up! im sure you got nothing to hide. u joined the forums online a few days ago and this is your second post, seems to me you couldnt hold yourself ...is it because you are so hurt with the Chebo decision that you couldnt help hold it any longer ?
J
JohnSydney
Guest
lol simqat
1. Im not Rima, ur not as smart as u make it out to be, im John. u talk about being careful with words etc yet u claim i am 2 ppl without providing any proof and u also say 'we all know' so whos 'we'? and what is it u exactly 'know'? shouldnt YOU be careful with wot u say? i say what i feel/think (like most others on this forum) and i dont need to hide unlike u. using surnames on this forum is just low, i dont really care anyways but still, some ppl dont like it. as for my 'threats' and 'tone' in an earlier post, i understand exactly what comes out of my mouth and i will apologise if its called for. Salem is a mature guy and doesnt need ur support or encouragement to ban me or my comments or staple my lips together.
2. im ignorant? sorry my legal/real estate vocab isnt up to ur standards my friend. obviously ur much more mature than me since u have useless info at ur disposal and ur just actually repeating things everyone has said already, ur questions are the same as everyone elses, hopefully i will be as intelligent and mature as u one day, then i can find a 'wife' also.
3.u can applaud david chibo. i admit i was suprised that someone had actually made these allegations, i mean someone had the guts to speak out and actually put his name on the article. he didnt show up to court yes thats true and u can call it a technicality, but in soccer if u win 1-0 it doesnt matter how the ball goes in cos at the end of the day the scoreboard reads 1-0 (sorry only example i could come up with) i wasnt for nor against chibo UNTIL zinda published the article anyways and deleted his name from their list of contributors, hence the title of 'no shame' to this topic. i only provided the link to the article on the website, i didnt know that resulted in me being vulnerable to a court summons.
4. u can keep calling me Rima if thats what turns u on
5. let me give u some info here simqat, as far as im concerned this is a dead issue, the whole mar meelis / khaled saga. once again i just outlined zindas lack of profressionalism by publishing the article, but i do commend them on their bravery. we sit here and argue/disagree with one another and i DO welcome other ppls comments, at the end of the day i would back up anyone else on here including Salem and Temp even if we have a difference of opinion, but u my friend, ur only contribution to this post has been disrespectful to us not only by providing our full names but also by speaking to us as if we are 5yr olds and know nothing. if YOU have all the answers to the assyrian communities problems, if YOU dont like what the church or its ppl are doing, then YOU like mr chibo should make ur concerns heard, not sit here and talk about 'real men' and hide behind a computer and unleash useless info at our faces.none of us are real mean so dont go using that label loosley, obviously u dont like me due to a history we might have together, but obviously u dont know me well enough and lets keep it that way. its only the church haters that need to voice their opinions in public, cos the church is bigger than all of us and wont be damaged by rumours or internet forum quarrels or woteva, its lasted thousands of years.
6.i welcome ppls opinion but i dont appreciate my name or peters family being thrown into it, and ur constant referral to my 'ignorance' ? im sorry i force u to always excuse my ignorance i really do. u want me to take u seriously when u keep thinking of me as stupid? u want me to respect wot u say yet u dont acknowledge one single thing ive said or u cant even understand my point of view? then whats my purpose in life? i should go kill myself if my opinions arent being understood la? not agreed too, but just understood
7. i never wanted this whole thing to flare up again cos to me its over n done with, it happend in the past and thats that. but certain ppl just wont let it go, theyre intent on highlighting the churches wrongs instead of focussing on their own lives, if we dont have our church then what do we have as assyrians? as i said in an earlier post and it was taken out of context, if u dont like the bishop or the way the church is run, then ppl shouldnt go there, its simple, either speak up or dont take qurbana from that particular priest/bishop, im not saying this in a disrespectful tone, but what else can u do? wot other options do u have? if ur not happy with ur doctor, ur mechanic or ur suburb even, u simply go somewhere else dont u. there are certain 'events' ill call them that our church puts on and i dont agree with a few things, so i stopped going, whether thats right or wrong of me is another issue, but its better for me to be free of headaches
8. in reference to ur no.8 comment simqat....i remember very well wot happend back then and my age means nothing,its very hard to forget what happend back then and yes of course my parents told me stories too and once again im telling u do NOT bring my family into this, i dont want them even mentioned by u, so theres alot i just dont know? lol good id rather keep it that way
9. simqat, is there anything ive said thats right? seriously i wanna know, since u know everything, maybe u can educate us on other issues too, how about it, ummm geee lets see, how about we start with ur identity? yeh that would be great, but then again im sure this situation brings u great satisfaction as u sit there behind ur screen and rub ur hands together relishing the power u have, good on ya pal!
10. i dont wana continue posting on this topic ok, i said it a couple of posts ago,its gone way overboard and totally off topic and thers always someone who mysteriously decides to become a new member just for the sake of posting here and stirring the pot, so plzzz if u wanna reply or u feel the need to attack me again or provide more personal info about me then go ahead, but id prefer u to do it in private with me, thanks.
1. Im not Rima, ur not as smart as u make it out to be, im John. u talk about being careful with words etc yet u claim i am 2 ppl without providing any proof and u also say 'we all know' so whos 'we'? and what is it u exactly 'know'? shouldnt YOU be careful with wot u say? i say what i feel/think (like most others on this forum) and i dont need to hide unlike u. using surnames on this forum is just low, i dont really care anyways but still, some ppl dont like it. as for my 'threats' and 'tone' in an earlier post, i understand exactly what comes out of my mouth and i will apologise if its called for. Salem is a mature guy and doesnt need ur support or encouragement to ban me or my comments or staple my lips together.
2. im ignorant? sorry my legal/real estate vocab isnt up to ur standards my friend. obviously ur much more mature than me since u have useless info at ur disposal and ur just actually repeating things everyone has said already, ur questions are the same as everyone elses, hopefully i will be as intelligent and mature as u one day, then i can find a 'wife' also.
3.u can applaud david chibo. i admit i was suprised that someone had actually made these allegations, i mean someone had the guts to speak out and actually put his name on the article. he didnt show up to court yes thats true and u can call it a technicality, but in soccer if u win 1-0 it doesnt matter how the ball goes in cos at the end of the day the scoreboard reads 1-0 (sorry only example i could come up with) i wasnt for nor against chibo UNTIL zinda published the article anyways and deleted his name from their list of contributors, hence the title of 'no shame' to this topic. i only provided the link to the article on the website, i didnt know that resulted in me being vulnerable to a court summons.
4. u can keep calling me Rima if thats what turns u on
5. let me give u some info here simqat, as far as im concerned this is a dead issue, the whole mar meelis / khaled saga. once again i just outlined zindas lack of profressionalism by publishing the article, but i do commend them on their bravery. we sit here and argue/disagree with one another and i DO welcome other ppls comments, at the end of the day i would back up anyone else on here including Salem and Temp even if we have a difference of opinion, but u my friend, ur only contribution to this post has been disrespectful to us not only by providing our full names but also by speaking to us as if we are 5yr olds and know nothing. if YOU have all the answers to the assyrian communities problems, if YOU dont like what the church or its ppl are doing, then YOU like mr chibo should make ur concerns heard, not sit here and talk about 'real men' and hide behind a computer and unleash useless info at our faces.none of us are real mean so dont go using that label loosley, obviously u dont like me due to a history we might have together, but obviously u dont know me well enough and lets keep it that way. its only the church haters that need to voice their opinions in public, cos the church is bigger than all of us and wont be damaged by rumours or internet forum quarrels or woteva, its lasted thousands of years.
6.i welcome ppls opinion but i dont appreciate my name or peters family being thrown into it, and ur constant referral to my 'ignorance' ? im sorry i force u to always excuse my ignorance i really do. u want me to take u seriously when u keep thinking of me as stupid? u want me to respect wot u say yet u dont acknowledge one single thing ive said or u cant even understand my point of view? then whats my purpose in life? i should go kill myself if my opinions arent being understood la? not agreed too, but just understood
7. i never wanted this whole thing to flare up again cos to me its over n done with, it happend in the past and thats that. but certain ppl just wont let it go, theyre intent on highlighting the churches wrongs instead of focussing on their own lives, if we dont have our church then what do we have as assyrians? as i said in an earlier post and it was taken out of context, if u dont like the bishop or the way the church is run, then ppl shouldnt go there, its simple, either speak up or dont take qurbana from that particular priest/bishop, im not saying this in a disrespectful tone, but what else can u do? wot other options do u have? if ur not happy with ur doctor, ur mechanic or ur suburb even, u simply go somewhere else dont u. there are certain 'events' ill call them that our church puts on and i dont agree with a few things, so i stopped going, whether thats right or wrong of me is another issue, but its better for me to be free of headaches
8. in reference to ur no.8 comment simqat....i remember very well wot happend back then and my age means nothing,its very hard to forget what happend back then and yes of course my parents told me stories too and once again im telling u do NOT bring my family into this, i dont want them even mentioned by u, so theres alot i just dont know? lol good id rather keep it that way
9. simqat, is there anything ive said thats right? seriously i wanna know, since u know everything, maybe u can educate us on other issues too, how about it, ummm geee lets see, how about we start with ur identity? yeh that would be great, but then again im sure this situation brings u great satisfaction as u sit there behind ur screen and rub ur hands together relishing the power u have, good on ya pal!
10. i dont wana continue posting on this topic ok, i said it a couple of posts ago,its gone way overboard and totally off topic and thers always someone who mysteriously decides to become a new member just for the sake of posting here and stirring the pot, so plzzz if u wanna reply or u feel the need to attack me again or provide more personal info about me then go ahead, but id prefer u to do it in private with me, thanks.
Back to the topic at hand
My contributions...From what I have seen and what has been stated previously, this particular article did not have an author mentioned, therefore liability/credit lays in the hands of the magazine and it's editors.
In regards to the actual content....Relatively a fine piece of investigative journalism. The provision of supporting documentation will make for heated debates for years to come.
My opinion...Chibo was stupid for alleging Mar Melis had the affair as it can't be proven. Mar Melis is not as intelligent as many people in our community seem to think as his careless comments and actions over the years have proved to be nails in his coffin, so to speak. I personally think the church would be a lot more productive and true to form (in a manner of speaking) if he was removed from his position. Offcourse Mar Dinkha won't allow that any day soon. I've always seen it is a 'divide and conquer' manoeuvre. I don't believe Mar Melis is really for unity, if he were, it would have happened 6 months after the Church split in 1989 when efforts were being made. I think he is not the most appropriate man for the job and the sheer amount of controversies involving his 'personal' life seem to heavily outnumber any other Bishops of the past.
Just imagine what could be achieved by a Bishop that had the support of the majority of Sydney Assyrians!
I believe it is quite evident that he has broken his vows and should therefore be replaced with someone more worthy of such an influential position.
My contributions...From what I have seen and what has been stated previously, this particular article did not have an author mentioned, therefore liability/credit lays in the hands of the magazine and it's editors.
In regards to the actual content....Relatively a fine piece of investigative journalism. The provision of supporting documentation will make for heated debates for years to come.
My opinion...Chibo was stupid for alleging Mar Melis had the affair as it can't be proven. Mar Melis is not as intelligent as many people in our community seem to think as his careless comments and actions over the years have proved to be nails in his coffin, so to speak. I personally think the church would be a lot more productive and true to form (in a manner of speaking) if he was removed from his position. Offcourse Mar Dinkha won't allow that any day soon. I've always seen it is a 'divide and conquer' manoeuvre. I don't believe Mar Melis is really for unity, if he were, it would have happened 6 months after the Church split in 1989 when efforts were being made. I think he is not the most appropriate man for the job and the sheer amount of controversies involving his 'personal' life seem to heavily outnumber any other Bishops of the past.
Just imagine what could be achieved by a Bishop that had the support of the majority of Sydney Assyrians!
I believe it is quite evident that he has broken his vows and should therefore be replaced with someone more worthy of such an influential position.
Thank you Jonh Sydney and Sydney Dude for responding to Simqat's nonsense. I share your views and will not seek to respond further on those points.
However, I will again simply refer to the Supreme Court decision and note that the Court of Law deemed the publications by Chibo to be false and defamatory. The buck stops with the Court and not Chibo or Zibla magazine. Chibo's incredible stupidity was also exposed for posting defamatory material under false pretense of Assyrian Utensil, and it is no wonder why he did not have the guts or proof to put on any defence in court. No one could put on a defence to such concucted conspiracy thoeries and unsubstantiated garbage.
Similarly, the second round of Zibla publications make ludicrous and unsubstantiated allegations such as Mar Meelis broke his wows of celibacy. This is clearly a defamatory allegation and Mar Meelis has every right to take this matter further, and it is crystal clear that he would succeed yet again just on this point alone, let alone on the other fabricated web of nonsense spun by Zibla. It is obviously for this reason that the moron author did not even have the manhood to publish his name this time round. Journalism does not get more COWARDLY than this!
Simqat, you have obviously formed your own opinion about the situation. However, please don't sit here and praise the idiotic scumbag Chibo when he has been found by the Supreme Court to be a liar, to have acted in bad faith, and to have published defamatory material in Zibla and other fourms against the Bishop (in the same way that you have done in your post).
There is no doubt that the Bishop has the continued support of the majority of the Assyrian congregation in Sydney and certainly his accolades and achievements in Australia for both the Church and the community have been unparralleled worldwide. Unfortunately, it is only the minority of the likes of morons like Chibo that seek to spread their poison through unscrupolous forums such as Zibla magazine in an attempt to bring disunity into our community and disrepute to our religious and political leaders.
So Simqat, it is clear that you are so personally involved in this issue, so sympathetic towards Chibo's cause, and so adamant to preach Zibla's reporting. You have even gone to the investigative trouble of discovering that JohnSydney and I are the same person. Your logic and special investigative methods are absolute genius and we have no doubt that there is a career cut out for you at Zibla Magazine if you chose to pursue it. That is of course unless you disclose your identity, in which case you would be in breach of the prerequisites for Zibla Magazine ethics of remaining anonymous when trying to trash the reputations of respected religious leaders.
However, I will again simply refer to the Supreme Court decision and note that the Court of Law deemed the publications by Chibo to be false and defamatory. The buck stops with the Court and not Chibo or Zibla magazine. Chibo's incredible stupidity was also exposed for posting defamatory material under false pretense of Assyrian Utensil, and it is no wonder why he did not have the guts or proof to put on any defence in court. No one could put on a defence to such concucted conspiracy thoeries and unsubstantiated garbage.
Similarly, the second round of Zibla publications make ludicrous and unsubstantiated allegations such as Mar Meelis broke his wows of celibacy. This is clearly a defamatory allegation and Mar Meelis has every right to take this matter further, and it is crystal clear that he would succeed yet again just on this point alone, let alone on the other fabricated web of nonsense spun by Zibla. It is obviously for this reason that the moron author did not even have the manhood to publish his name this time round. Journalism does not get more COWARDLY than this!
Simqat, you have obviously formed your own opinion about the situation. However, please don't sit here and praise the idiotic scumbag Chibo when he has been found by the Supreme Court to be a liar, to have acted in bad faith, and to have published defamatory material in Zibla and other fourms against the Bishop (in the same way that you have done in your post).
There is no doubt that the Bishop has the continued support of the majority of the Assyrian congregation in Sydney and certainly his accolades and achievements in Australia for both the Church and the community have been unparralleled worldwide. Unfortunately, it is only the minority of the likes of morons like Chibo that seek to spread their poison through unscrupolous forums such as Zibla magazine in an attempt to bring disunity into our community and disrepute to our religious and political leaders.
So Simqat, it is clear that you are so personally involved in this issue, so sympathetic towards Chibo's cause, and so adamant to preach Zibla's reporting. You have even gone to the investigative trouble of discovering that JohnSydney and I are the same person. Your logic and special investigative methods are absolute genius and we have no doubt that there is a career cut out for you at Zibla Magazine if you chose to pursue it. That is of course unless you disclose your identity, in which case you would be in breach of the prerequisites for Zibla Magazine ethics of remaining anonymous when trying to trash the reputations of respected religious leaders.
Rima said:
God tried to imitate him, but he failed, that's how good he is. He's a miracle worker, this bishop of yours.
Rima said:
You need to READ what you're voicing your opinion about and stop just following the orders of your boss like a robot.
Rima said:
He sure does, and the pigs that fly around the church after the Sunday mass are a proof of that.
Evil cannot survive for too long, and change is near as more & more people are getting sick of the corruption and gang-style attitude inside the church.
Just last week actually, I was coming home from work and I heard a lady talking in the phone in Assyrian to her friend, the topic was non other than the 2nd article and and the defamation case, her exact comment regarding the bishop suing someone was "pishla miskhara", and many more feel exactly the same way.
Let's hope change happens sooner rather than later.
There's just no point responding in any length to your post and your empty anecdotes because you are clearly disrespectful and pigheaded, and you obviously thrive on conspiracy.
All I can say is that it is you who needs to READ what your voicing your opinion about, rather than just spreading unsubstantiated rumours/conspiracies with your sarcastic and disrespectful tone. Secondly, I don't know what Church you belong too, but there is a simple answer to your problem with our Bishop - do not attend our Church and find something more useful to do with your time than attacking our Bishop.
As for the defamation case against Chibo, everyone that I know has rejoiced in this decision because the trash that Zibla publishes was deemed by the Court to be defamatory and the Bishop was vindicated. It is most likely that the lady you overheard talking over the phone said "peshla maskhara" because she was referring to the stupidity of Zibla magazine for having no shame and doing exactly the same thing when one of its imbecile staff had been ordered to pay over $200,000 for the first defamatory publication.
The thing that gets me is that Zibla magazine prints all this defamatory garbage about the Bishop, and others simply jump on the rumour and hate bandwagon, however even after the Bishop takes the appropriate course of action to expose the truth in the Court of Law (and succeeds), it is those exact same people that criticize the Bishop for taking this action. Those same people also say that this is not Christian, but they are the first to spread rumours and throw their daggers when the garbage is printed. They also say that the Bishop should forgive the publishers of the defamatory material, but they fail to see that this action has nothing to do with forgiveness but rather in exposing the truth and furthermore, the culprits that publish this garbage have absolutely no shame or respect and have not at any stage asked for forgiveness.
All I can say is that it is you who needs to READ what your voicing your opinion about, rather than just spreading unsubstantiated rumours/conspiracies with your sarcastic and disrespectful tone. Secondly, I don't know what Church you belong too, but there is a simple answer to your problem with our Bishop - do not attend our Church and find something more useful to do with your time than attacking our Bishop.
As for the defamation case against Chibo, everyone that I know has rejoiced in this decision because the trash that Zibla publishes was deemed by the Court to be defamatory and the Bishop was vindicated. It is most likely that the lady you overheard talking over the phone said "peshla maskhara" because she was referring to the stupidity of Zibla magazine for having no shame and doing exactly the same thing when one of its imbecile staff had been ordered to pay over $200,000 for the first defamatory publication.
The thing that gets me is that Zibla magazine prints all this defamatory garbage about the Bishop, and others simply jump on the rumour and hate bandwagon, however even after the Bishop takes the appropriate course of action to expose the truth in the Court of Law (and succeeds), it is those exact same people that criticize the Bishop for taking this action. Those same people also say that this is not Christian, but they are the first to spread rumours and throw their daggers when the garbage is printed. They also say that the Bishop should forgive the publishers of the defamatory material, but they fail to see that this action has nothing to do with forgiveness but rather in exposing the truth and furthermore, the culprits that publish this garbage have absolutely no shame or respect and have not at any stage asked for forgiveness.
I was sarcastic, YES, but I didn't use personal insults, so please choose your words more carefully in the future.
Our church!!! It's not YOUR church, it's God's church and everyone can go to it if they feel like it. Your bishop is an average human being, no more, no less, and as such, neither you nor him can tell me which church I can go to and which church I can't.
No, she wasn't referring to what you said, she was referring to the fact that church figures are suing people in this day & age, and she went to talk about the scanned documents in the new article and express her disapproval of his actions.
Even though I don't think he should've sued anyone in the 1st place, BUT even if we go with your argument, the bishop could've simply proven him wrong WITHOUT the monetary compensation.
As "simqat" rightly pointed out, the Pope was almost killed, and HE went and visited the attacker and HE was the one who forgave him, he didn't wait for the attacker to ask for forgiveness.
Your failure to respond to my questions regarding the official proceedings of the liquidation of Khaled's assets and your bishop's mentioned name in several parts of it, shows your lack of objectivity beyond any doubt.
The reason why I responded to your post sarcastically is because you will never listen or dare to confront the facts that were published in official websites and that you'll always look at one side of the argument, and never consider or even read what others have to say, hence making the argument with you pointless.
Our church!!! It's not YOUR church, it's God's church and everyone can go to it if they feel like it. Your bishop is an average human being, no more, no less, and as such, neither you nor him can tell me which church I can go to and which church I can't.
No, she wasn't referring to what you said, she was referring to the fact that church figures are suing people in this day & age, and she went to talk about the scanned documents in the new article and express her disapproval of his actions.
Even though I don't think he should've sued anyone in the 1st place, BUT even if we go with your argument, the bishop could've simply proven him wrong WITHOUT the monetary compensation.
As "simqat" rightly pointed out, the Pope was almost killed, and HE went and visited the attacker and HE was the one who forgave him, he didn't wait for the attacker to ask for forgiveness.
Your failure to respond to my questions regarding the official proceedings of the liquidation of Khaled's assets and your bishop's mentioned name in several parts of it, shows your lack of objectivity beyond any doubt.
The reason why I responded to your post sarcastically is because you will never listen or dare to confront the facts that were published in official websites and that you'll always look at one side of the argument, and never consider or even read what others have to say, hence making the argument with you pointless.
Your right, I will never listen to your rumour, lies and hate propaganda.
Official Websites??? There is ZERO websites that prove that the Bishop broke his wow of celibacy or that he was an architect of the scheme as you and your Zibla Magazine liars feel so comfortable in alleging.
Just because the Bishop's name is mentioned in the liquidator's "official proceeding" does not mean anything. These issues have been addressed by the Bishop on national tv and in national radio. There was no doubt that Khaled donated to the Church, amongst heaps other Assyrian charities, organisations, clubs, and people. These are old issues and the Bishop agreed from the beginning to pay all the donations back.
Again, this does not mean that the organisations that received the donations were guilty of anything as you make out. If this were the case, then Bill Clinton, George Bush Senior, the Westmead Children's Hospital, and Nineveh Club are all guilty of evil.
But Moja Moja's joke about logic seems to be exactly the way your logic operates. So perhaps you can tell me whether you own a violin and we can all learn more about you.
As for proving him wrong without the monetary compensation, that is the stupidist thing I have ever heard. The fact that HE HAS PROVED HIM WRONG in court doesn't seem to affect your narrow mindedness and the shameless words and allegations that you express. The fact that Monetary compensation has been given by the Court just goes to show the level of falsity and defamation in the publication - if you write things like that you should be prepared to put your money where your mouth is and back up your allegations with hard proof rather than some limited information (again, this seems to be a difficult thing for you too grasp). So in the end there is no point arguing with you because you will continue with your slander of the Bishop, your flawed and primitive logic will never develop in this lifetime, and in your mind Zibla Magazine is a higher and more respected authority than the Supreme Court or any court for that matter of fact. Even if God came down and told you otherwise you would still continue to believe what you want to believe because your heart is not pure and your mind is only capable of spreading rumours about the next person rather than focusing on your own life and inadequacies.
Official Websites??? There is ZERO websites that prove that the Bishop broke his wow of celibacy or that he was an architect of the scheme as you and your Zibla Magazine liars feel so comfortable in alleging.
Just because the Bishop's name is mentioned in the liquidator's "official proceeding" does not mean anything. These issues have been addressed by the Bishop on national tv and in national radio. There was no doubt that Khaled donated to the Church, amongst heaps other Assyrian charities, organisations, clubs, and people. These are old issues and the Bishop agreed from the beginning to pay all the donations back.
Again, this does not mean that the organisations that received the donations were guilty of anything as you make out. If this were the case, then Bill Clinton, George Bush Senior, the Westmead Children's Hospital, and Nineveh Club are all guilty of evil.
But Moja Moja's joke about logic seems to be exactly the way your logic operates. So perhaps you can tell me whether you own a violin and we can all learn more about you.
As for proving him wrong without the monetary compensation, that is the stupidist thing I have ever heard. The fact that HE HAS PROVED HIM WRONG in court doesn't seem to affect your narrow mindedness and the shameless words and allegations that you express. The fact that Monetary compensation has been given by the Court just goes to show the level of falsity and defamation in the publication - if you write things like that you should be prepared to put your money where your mouth is and back up your allegations with hard proof rather than some limited information (again, this seems to be a difficult thing for you too grasp). So in the end there is no point arguing with you because you will continue with your slander of the Bishop, your flawed and primitive logic will never develop in this lifetime, and in your mind Zibla Magazine is a higher and more respected authority than the Supreme Court or any court for that matter of fact. Even if God came down and told you otherwise you would still continue to believe what you want to believe because your heart is not pure and your mind is only capable of spreading rumours about the next person rather than focusing on your own life and inadequacies.
Once again, I must ask you to show some respect and discuss in a civilised manner.
I did not claim that he broke his vow of celibacy, nor did I claim that he was the architect of Khaled's scheme, not even once, and I challenge you to show me one quote in which I claimed that. So stop spreading your lies just to prove a point.
Doesn't mean anything!!! Why would he accept a $50,000 car from a crook? Why would he attend public events with him? Why did he accept the 5% shares in Froggy? All of these things do not mean anything to you?
A church figure is not the same as all those other groups you mentioned. Our community doesn't follow an organisation, a club, or a normal person, they follow the church leader, and as a leader, and according to his vow of poverty and religious background, he needed to act as a role for his community by having NOTHING to do with this crook.
Your idiotic joke shows only your emptiness and immaturity. If you do decide to become a stand up comedian, you'll get enough tomatoes in your face to export tomato paste overseas.
For a money hungry gang like you & your bishop, it must be.
The court proved him wrong on these issues:
I quite clearly acknowledged on AVN the fact that these claims shouldn't have been made as the author didn't have proof to back them up.
The court did NOT prove him wrong on all the other "backed-up with proof" claims that he made in his article, which your bishop knew he could never win, so he just didn't go near them.
So I'm not the narrow minded person here, I have said it before and I'll say it again that these 4 points should never have been made in the article.
It seems that it's too difficult for you "to" grasp the idea that a bishop should not be thinking in such a mentality, which clearly contradicts one of the basic teachings of Christ, forgiveness.
Primitive!!! Now where have I heard that before? That's right, it was the word your holy bishop chose to describe his own people.
What rumors!!! Show me one instance in which I have done this? You get stuck and you start with your empty lies, what a joke!!!
Whether my heart is pure or not, is none of your business, and is not the subject of discussion here so stick to the topic.
I did not claim that he broke his vow of celibacy, nor did I claim that he was the architect of Khaled's scheme, not even once, and I challenge you to show me one quote in which I claimed that. So stop spreading your lies just to prove a point.
Doesn't mean anything!!! Why would he accept a $50,000 car from a crook? Why would he attend public events with him? Why did he accept the 5% shares in Froggy? All of these things do not mean anything to you?
A church figure is not the same as all those other groups you mentioned. Our community doesn't follow an organisation, a club, or a normal person, they follow the church leader, and as a leader, and according to his vow of poverty and religious background, he needed to act as a role for his community by having NOTHING to do with this crook.
Your idiotic joke shows only your emptiness and immaturity. If you do decide to become a stand up comedian, you'll get enough tomatoes in your face to export tomato paste overseas.
For a money hungry gang like you & your bishop, it must be.
The court proved him wrong on these issues:
I quite clearly acknowledged on AVN the fact that these claims shouldn't have been made as the author didn't have proof to back them up.
The court did NOT prove him wrong on all the other "backed-up with proof" claims that he made in his article, which your bishop knew he could never win, so he just didn't go near them.
So I'm not the narrow minded person here, I have said it before and I'll say it again that these 4 points should never have been made in the article.
It seems that it's too difficult for you "to" grasp the idea that a bishop should not be thinking in such a mentality, which clearly contradicts one of the basic teachings of Christ, forgiveness.
Primitive!!! Now where have I heard that before? That's right, it was the word your holy bishop chose to describe his own people.
What rumors!!! Show me one instance in which I have done this? You get stuck and you start with your empty lies, what a joke!!!
Whether my heart is pure or not, is none of your business, and is not the subject of discussion here so stick to the topic.
J
JohnSydney
Guest
i said i wouldnt contribute to this post again, but u guys r seriously overdoing it now. we can argue and discuss these issues thats fine, dont take this personally, ur talking about using a respectful and civilised manner in which to disucss these issues yet u keep referring to mar meelis as 'your bishop' and u use alot of hatred in ur tone. firstly the bishop hasnt done anything to us personally and i would never put down any other bishop from any other assyrian church the way u and others have, thats disrespectful, cos ur not only disrespecting him, but the church which gave him his authority and hence disrespecting Jesus himself. im sure neither one of us have those intentions. as said in my previous posts, if you were all in my shoes, the shoes of a supporter, u would be very hurt to see ppl ridicule the bishop, his not my bishop or urs, but ours, a representative of the assyrian community and let me also point out that he regularly attends meetings within the christian community in sydney and is a regular attendee at the national council of churches, therfore he represents us as a community. all the other sydney bishops from all the churches respect him alot and they are very well educated and up to date with current affairs and the law, they too are familiar with whats happening in our community, they have a duty to be involved as we are governed by the council of churches in this country. like him or not, he is still a 'man of God' and its not up to us to humiliate him nor punish him, we can leave that to God himself.
this msg goes to everyone who might reply to this post again, im all for healthy debates on this issue, but plz lets show some mutual respect here.
(ive already dealt with Rima about this)
this msg goes to everyone who might reply to this post again, im all for healthy debates on this issue, but plz lets show some mutual respect here.
(ive already dealt with Rima about this)