What are your favourite and least favourite Assyrian dialects?
- Thread starter Cascade
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My favorite is Iraqi Koine simply because of its usefulness, if something is useful, then stick to it.... secondly I too would have to say Classical Syriac.
In any circumstances, I wouldn't go as far to say that I have a least favorite dialect, perhaps it's because i'm not exposed to any but Koine...
But if I HAD to choose a least favorite, it's the one that uses many borrowed words (I don't really know which one that is...)
In any circumstances, I wouldn't go as far to say that I have a least favorite dialect, perhaps it's because i'm not exposed to any but Koine...
But if I HAD to choose a least favorite, it's the one that uses many borrowed words (I don't really know which one that is...)
Is there a video with different dialects? Please post it here.
I tried wikipedia but, the sound samples are too short to even judge. However, Classical Syriac > Iraqi koine > Chaldean > Tyari > and I disliked the Urmian one because it sort of has Farsi sound to it more than a seimitic one.
I tried wikipedia but, the sound samples are too short to even judge. However, Classical Syriac > Iraqi koine > Chaldean > Tyari > and I disliked the Urmian one because it sort of has Farsi sound to it more than a seimitic one.
Cascade
Well-known member
All Assyrian dialects have equal amounts of borrowed words. Chaldean has the most Arabic words though. I think Turoyo (Western Assyrian) still retains the Syriac words, if I'm not mistaken.Rom?n said:
Iraqi Koine: ! No longer availableGoogoo said:
Urmian: ! No longer available
Chaldean: ! No longer available
Tyari (couldn't find a speech sample, so I came up with a song): ! No longer available
Turoyo (Western Assyrian, NOT Assyrian Neo-Aramaic): ! No longer available
To be fair, Urmian has a more authentic Assyrian sound to it, considering that many Assyrians would typically have a dialect similar to Urmian ---- Iraqi Koine, Jelu and Nochiya dialects are a lot closer to Urmian. Tyari is like a "lovechild" of Urmian and Chaldean (as it uses the Th sounds). You can say that Chaldean is a concoction of Western Assyrian (Turoyo) and Assyrian Neo-Aramaic, although it still sounds more Eastern. As in, it will be more intelligible to us than to Western Assyrians.
Btw, like Urmian, Chaldean is also a dialect with a foreign sound -- In this case, Arabic. So it's pretty much not any "better" than Urmian.
Neon said:
Since I understand the 'Maloula' aramaic, the Chaldean one sounds so close to it for instance, that wikipedia sample had some Iraqi Arabic words (so ignoring that) and just focusing on the Chaldean makes it very similar to the Maloula one.
Thank for the videos. Linda looks pretty in that video though I usually find Juliana much prettier and I prefer her over Linda. :razz:
Cascade
Well-known member
Yes, Chaldean sounds a lot like Maloula and Turoyo (Western Aramaic), even though it's more intelligible to us than to Western Aramaic speakers. They use Th's, guttural H and Eh sounds. You can say that they speak Assyrian in a Western Aramaic accent.Googoo said:
Linda and Juliana are both pretty in their own way. Juliana was very pretty in the 80s and 90s. Linda George got prettier as she aged. Ever since the mid 2000s, Juliana started to look too plastic, unfortunately (cheeks, lips).
Carlo
Active member
Neon said:
No, Urmian is one of the least "authentic"-sounding dialects. The only reason it's even vaguely considered as a "standard" is because, in the 19th century, Justin Perkins, an American missionary, came over and arbitrarily chose Urmian to be the language in which the Bible was going to be translated for all Assyrian Neo-Aramaic speakers, even though most of the Neo-Aramaic speakers at the time in Hakkari and the Nineveh Plains spoke dialects that were a lot more conservative. Before then, the modern dialects were almost never used in writing (for centuries, that honour would go to Classical Syriac).
Tyari is not the "lovechild" of anything---it preserves the "th" sounds from 2500+ years ago from the days of Imperial Aramaic, as do the Chaldean, Turoyo, and Classical Syriac dialects. Urmian, Jilu and Nochiya lost those sounds some time within the last few centuries (the dialects are related and probably branched off the same dialect or influenced each other due to proximity).
Neon said:
It depends on the specific dialect within Chaldean, there is no "one" Chaldean dialect any more than there is "one" Nestorian dialect. The Alqosh dialect, for example, has a lot less Arabic loanwords than, say, the Telsqop dialect.
Cascade
Well-known member
I know this. All I meant was that Urmian would be a bit "more" authentic than other dialects because most of the Assyrians nowadays sound closer to Urmian than the other dialects (i.e. Iraqi Koine). Sure, traditionally, it isn't an authentic dialect due to its Farsi influence, but so many Eastern Assyrians retain its sound.Carlo said:
I'm aware that Tyari isn't a lovechild of anything, hence the quotation marks I made. I merely meant that it has features of Chaldean and Urmian dialects -- NOT that it borrowed these attributes from them. I was trying to explain what dialects soundalike and such.
The differences between Chaldean dialects seem to be minor, but I know that there are some differences, if a bit subtle.
Carlo
Active member
Neon said:
Are you not counting Chaldean Assyrians and Western Assyrians in "most of the Assyrians nowadays?"
Neon said:
Thank you for clarifying. The wording you chose heavily implied the opposite. In a field where "mother," "daughter," and "sister languages/dialects" are actual used terms, "lovechild" serves to confuse, as children descend from parents are are younger. It made it seem like you're saying the Tyari dialects aren't more original or are a hybrid and the Standard Urmian isn't the one that deviated from the others.
Why don't you say Tyari retains features of the "mother" dialect and the Chaldean and Urmian dialects deviated from that mother dialect? Why aren't Chaldean and Urmian the daughters of Tyari?
(I'm playing Devil's Advocate here, by the way. The real answer is that they are in what's called a "dialect continuum," with Chaldean being on one side of the spectrum of tongues, Urmian on the other, and Tyari in the middle. That's what you meant to say.)
Cascade
Well-known member
Yes. The thing is, many Chaldeans don't consider themselves Assyrians. And Western Assyrians speak a different language, or at least a very distinct dialect. Yes I know, this is debatable; People would argue that they speak the same language (Syriac), but at the end of the day it's not Assyrian Neo-Aramaic. If you know what I mean.Carlo said:
Yeah, I understand that you would perceive it that way. I do have the habit of speaking in metaphors and the likes. People shouldn't take me very literally. Lol.
Yep. I read about the Assyrian dialect continuum.Why don't you say Tyari retains features of the "mother" dialect and the Chaldean and Urmian dialects deviated from that mother dialect? Why aren't Chaldean and Urmian the daughters of Tyari?
(I'm playing Devil's Advocate here, by the way. The real answer is that they are in what's called a "dialect continuum," with Chaldean being on one side of the spectrum of tongues, Urmian on the other, and Tyari in the middle. That's what you meant to say.)
The more eastwards you go in Hakkari the more Urmian you'd sound. And the more western you go, the more Tyari you'd sound. And if you go even further to the southwest you'd begin to sound Chaldean.
Even Chinese languages have a dialect continuum. England too, interestingly - For instance, the dialects in Northern England (i.e. Geordie), which border Scotland, actually sound more like Scottish than English. :mrgreen:
Straw King
New member
The Iranian Assyrians' dialect is just annoying to me but they probably feel the same way about mine too
Straw King
New member
SaranayaNeon said:
Cascade
Well-known member
Where is that based, in Hakkari, Iran or Northern Iraq?Straw King said:
Okay, since this is easier to me, I distinguish dialects on how they pronounce words - Do you use "th" instead of "t" (beta = betha)? If so, then you're similar to Tyaris, and that your village is somewhere around there.
Straw King
New member
Neon said:
We're based in Iraq and Syria and we say beta. What about you?
I love most Assyrian dialects, but the following have to be my favorite:
1-Jilwaye
2-Baznaye
3-Ashetnaye
I don't mind our barwar accent too, but Barwar has a lot of villages, and depends on which one. Mine is Tashish, and since I am used to it, I love it when the elders speak it, they have the pure and original accent (it is actually close to a Tyare dialect)
Of course, I also like to listen to the pure Ourmijnaye, Nocheyaye, Qochesnaye, Marboushaney and other similar dialects.
ASHOOR
P.S: if you want to hear a pure Jilwaye accent, watch this video below (the content may not be pleasant to some)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXSbvUZIEdA
1-Jilwaye
2-Baznaye
3-Ashetnaye
I don't mind our barwar accent too, but Barwar has a lot of villages, and depends on which one. Mine is Tashish, and since I am used to it, I love it when the elders speak it, they have the pure and original accent (it is actually close to a Tyare dialect)
Of course, I also like to listen to the pure Ourmijnaye, Nocheyaye, Qochesnaye, Marboushaney and other similar dialects.
ASHOOR
P.S: if you want to hear a pure Jilwaye accent, watch this video below (the content may not be pleasant to some)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXSbvUZIEdA
Straw King
New member
Yes we were originally from Hakkari. There is some Saranayeh in Turkey but they're small in numbers. Most are in Iraq and Syria.Neon said: