Save Christians of Iraq Demonstration

Enki

Enki

Active member
Hey guys. I know this is short notice but we had just gotten this flyer Sunday. Shockingly (sarcasm) this was not read in Church. But should be read in Church this coming Sunday. From what I understand, its a coalition of church groups both in and out of Iraq that are working together as a Christian front to help the Christians in Iraq. Here is the flyer. I hope all of you that are able to attend, attend. Bring your flags, bring some signs, bring your voice!

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Peaceful Demonstration

Downtown Toronto, Ontario
From Front St. & Bay St. through University Ave. North to the Ontario Parliament Building (Queen's Park).

June 17t, 2007. 2:00pm - 4:00pm.

The objective is to have a demonstration as a sign of solidarity with the Iraqi Christians who face these days sever persecution from fanatic people and organizations in the Iraqi major cities forcing them to leave all their assets and flee; otherwise they will face three options:

1) Paying taxes according to the Islamic law (Sharia)
2) Converting to Islam
3) Being killed

This is happening at the time that the Iraqi Government is watching without an any action!

Gathering will be at 1:45pm at Front and Bay. Please be there by then to obtain signs and flags. Date to be confirmed throughout http://www.ankawa.com and http://www.iraqichristiansrm.com

Remember to show your support and to come with as many friends as you can bring with you. Be loud, be rambunctious. Let your voice be heard!
 
This is awesome, you guys kick ass.

Is this for all Christians of Iraq?  Or is this mainly for the Assyrians of Iraq?
 
As in many demonstrations there will be banners mentioning the word Iraq and there will be Canadian and perhaps Assyrian flags (if this is a Christian only demonstration then national flags perhaps will not be raised) However, for goodness sake don't raise the Iraqi flag in the demonstration and before you go all up in arms here is why... If you want to answer please provide me with logical answers.

This flag represents oppression because under it many Assyrians, Christians and other Iraqis were persecuted.Hence it shouldn't be raised in any demonstrations held by Assyrians nor should any Assyrians display it in their cars or any where else.

Here is why:

Generally these colours red, white, black and green are the traditional colours used by the pan-Arab movement...

Red
The Khawarij were the first Islamic group to emerge after the assassination of Caliph Uthman III, forming the first republican party in the early days of Islam. Their symbol was the red flag. Arab tribes who participated in the conquest of North Africa and Andalusia carried the red flag, which became the symbol of the Islamic rulers of Andalusia (756-1355).
In modern times, red symbolizes the Ashrafs [ie. Sharifians] of the Hijaz and the Hashemites, descendants of the Prophet.

Green: The Fatimid Dynasty (909-1171), North Africa
The Fatimid Dynasty was founded in Morocco by Abdullah Al-Mahdi, and went on rule all of North Africa. They took green as their color, to symbolize their allegiance to Ali, the Prophet's cousin, who was once wrapped in a green coverlet in place of the Prophet in order to thwart an assassination attempt.

White: The Umayyad Dynasty (661-750), Damascus
The Umayyads ruled for ninety years, taking white as their symbolic color as a reminder of the Prophet's first battle at Badr, and to distinguish themselves from the Abbasids, by using white, rather than black, as their color of mourning. Mu'awia Ibn Abi Sufian (661-750), founder of the Umayyad state, proclaimed himself Caliph of Jerusalem.

Black: The Prophet Mohammad (570-632)
In the seventh century, with the rise of Islam and subsequent liberation of Mecca, two flags - one white, one black - were carried. On the white flag was written, "There is no god but God (Allah) and Mohammad is the Prophet of God."
In pre-Islamic times, the black flag was a sign of revenge. It was the color of the headdress worn when leading troops into battle. Both black and white flags were placed in the mosque during Friday prayers.
The Abbasid Dynasty (750-1258), ruling from Baghdad, took black as a symbol of mourning for the assassination of relatives of the Prophet and in remembrance of the Battle of Karbala.

The three stars: the three words of the Baath motto, "freedom, unity, socialism" .Before the coup in Iraq which brought the former regime these stars signified the desire for the Arab unity,particularly between Iraq,Syria and Egypt.

Lastly The words in arabic God is Great are unfortunately uttered in peace and in war,and I won't add any further comments to this because you should know the significance.







 
Shami,

Thank you and the feeling is mutual.

My post came out of frustration every time I saw people raising the same flag under which they and their families have been persecuted without even thinking that they are contradicting themselves.

They demonstrate against persecution yet they re-affirm that persecution without knowing it.

This is not against Iraq as a country because that land and every particle of its soil belongs to the Assyrians (with all their different denominations) and any one else who supports and feels being Assyrian, but we shouldn't be the ones to support and promote our persecutors.
 
Nina, initially I was going to bring some Iraqi flags to wave, but I too had doubts about it. Your post made me decide not to bring them. Cheers!

But one thing we need to comprehend now as Assyrians and as Assyrian Christians. We need to understand what is going on in Iraq. Iraq has become a religious war and not one of ethnicity and race.

You no longer hear "Arab" you hear "Sunni" or "Shia". You also no longer hear "Assyrian" or "Chaldean" (not that I ever heard it) you hear "Christian". The only people that have been able to preserve their ethnic identy throughout the war have been the Kurds (and good for them!).

We need to understand, we are not being targeted because we call our selves Assyrian, or Chaldean, or Syriac, or Aremnian, or Puteekh, or Riza, or Masta!

We're being targeted because we have a cross around our neck.

Because we believe Jesus was the last prophet and he died for our sins.

We're targeted because we believe in freedom for men, women, and young children.

Because we seek to advance ourselves and to not return back to the past but rather improve for the future.

These are the reasons we're being attacked. I say, at the protest, we one better everyone else and bring flags or pictures of crosses or of Jesus. We bring statues of Mary or anything religious that we can get our hands on. Let them see that we'll forever be connected to Christ.

If they want a Jihad, let them know our brave Christian men will stand up to the rise of evil and we will forever be protected by His power in this life or the next!
 
You're right, but my point is about this protest.

When you talk about ethnic heritage absolutly we're 100% Assyrian. In fact, I'm Assyrian BEFORE I'm Christian. I was born Assyrian and baptized Christian.

In any case, this particular protest is ment at shedding light on us as the Christians. Again, its a, I dont want to use the words but I'm not "wordy"..lol...political move. Yes, we're Assyrians, but our main identifier is the fact that we're Christians. So why not utilize this as a resource to further or goals as Assyrians?

We use the "Christian" card for our benifit.

This new autonomous region for the "Christians" will then be known by its historical background since majority rules. Historically, we will be known as "Assyria". Therefor making us Assyrian.

I know its a long process, and we all want to jump the gun. But patience is a bliss. We've come this far....lets keep going!
 
Riza o shourba,

That is why I said if it's a church coalition then there are those whithin it who will not agree with the word Assyrian,that is why I said if they are heading a Christian demonstration and even if not forget about the Iraqi flag. I've been watching demonstrations even the one in stockholm they were marching and holding the Iraqi flag not thinking that their people are being persecuted under that flag and the two words written on it.Do we call them naive so as not to use another word?

As for the word Assyrian,yes it is our national name and we shall not give it up but unfortunately the powers to be with the help of some of our own played their dirty games and attached a religious word to us so that our national identity would be erased and this not only served the muslims but the kurds as well.

Again, in this coming demonstration I urge you to be the one explaining to the people who might bring Iraqi flags why they shouldn't be so happy about it but rather ashamed.
 
i agree on seperating faith and ethnicity, however if your gonna take that approach (which i prefer) then you cant claim the persecution happening in central iraq to your cause. that persecution is faith based and not ethnicity based.

so u gotta argue against ethnic based persecution. thats mostly happening in northern iraq with the kurds denying our identity.

:doh: unfortunately thats how i see the tradeoff...is it just be or is this starting to get really confusing...
 
sydneydude said:
i agree on seperating faith and ethnicity, however if your gonna take that approach (which i prefer) then you cant claim the persecution happening in central iraq to your cause. that persecution is faith based and not ethnicity based.
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Sorry guys I am not a very good writer and I probably didn't explain my self right.

I understand that Muslims are not killing us because we are Assyrian.  But why does that mean we leave the name "Assyrian" out?  We are equally persecuted for our Christianity whether we say "Iraqi Christian" or "Iraqi ASSYRIAN Christian".  In other words, yes it is our faith that singles us out, but why does that make us drop the ethnic name? 

We get just as much attention and will actually start to be called by our correct name if we keep repeating "Assyrian Christian Assyrian Christian Assyrian Christian".

Otherwise Fox news et al. will label us as they have been:  Christians of Kurdistan.  Christians of Iraq.  Christians of Turkey.  We leave ourselves disconnected from each other.
 
waleeta said:
Sorry guys I am not a very good writer and I probably didn't explain my self right.

I understand that Muslims are not killing us because we are Assyrian.  But why does that mean we leave the name "Assyrian" out?  We are equally persecuted for our Christianity whether we say "Iraqi Christian" or "Iraqi ASSYRIAN Christian".  In other words, yes it is our faith that singles us out, but why does that make us drop the ethnic name? 

We get just as much attention and will actually start to be called by our correct name if we keep repeating "Assyrian Christian Assyrian Christian Assyrian Christian".

Otherwise Fox news et al. will label us as they have been:  Christians of Kurdistan.  Christians of Iraq.  Christians of Turkey.  We leave ourselves disconnected from each other.
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That's killing 2 birds with one stone...people always talk of persecution against 'Jews'...One title for religious and cultural affiliation...brilliant wouldn't you say?
 
baklawa said:
Why are muslims bloodthristy?
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They aren't the only ones bloodthristy, from what I've read in that thread about Turkey invading Iraq, I can rightfully say christians are more bloodthursty.
 
Darkseid said:
They aren't the only ones bloodthristy, from what I've read in that thread about Turkey invading Iraq, I can rightfully say christians are more bloodthursty.
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Wishful thinking is quite different from actually committing the act.
 
baklawa said:
Wishful thinking is quite different from actually committing the act.
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Not really if you understand psychology.

You can kill someone without even realizing it. Pre-meditary measures are always more crucial to the evaluation of someone's inner demon. Christians seem to have a lot of inner-demons. Perhaps they are not really christians at all.

What I'd say is don't measure someone by their religious standings, save those that deserve to be saved plain and simple.
 
Darkseid said:
Not really if you understand psychology.

You can kill someone without even realizing it. Pre-meditary measures are always more crucial to the evaluation of someone's inner demon. Christians seem to have a lot of inner-demons. Perhaps they are not really christians at all.

What I'd say is don't measure someone by their religious standings, save those that deserve to be saved plain and simple.
Click to expand...

As humans, you're damn right in the observation that many of us Assyrians are blood thirsty. But see here's the difference.

We as CHRISTIAN Assyrians understand that it is a sin to kill and thus we don't act on our thoughts but rather, pray for forgiveness and pray to find a different way to solve that problem. Muslims on the other hand TEACH killing in the Quran!

Qur'an 2:191  "And kill them wherever you find and catch them. Drive them out from where they have turned you out; for Al-Fitnah (polytheism, disbelief, oppression) is worse than slaughter."

Qur'an 33:60 "Truly, if the Hypocrites stir up sedition, if the agitators in the City do not desist, We shall urge you to go against them and set you over them. Then they will not be able to stay as your neighbors for any length of time. They shall have a curse on them. Whenever they are found, they shall be seized and slain without mercy - a fierce slaughter - murdered, a horrible murdering."

Blood thirsty? Maybe. But unlike Muslims, we don't act on our thoughts because of our civil and spiritual following. The TRUE path to the heavens and the TRUE path to Allah, Jesus Christ!
 
Just thought I'd add this quote too :)

Qur'an 9:29  "Fight against those People of the Book [Christians and Jews] who do not follow what Allah and His Messenger acknowledge as the true religion (Islam), nor accept Our law, until they pay the Jizyah tribute tax in submission."
 
Darkseid said:
Not really if you understand psychology.

You can kill someone without even realizing it. Pre-meditary measures are always more crucial to the evaluation of someone's inner demon. Christians seem to have a lot of inner-demons. Perhaps they are not really christians at all.

What I'd say is don't measure someone by their religious standings, save those that deserve to be saved plain and simple.
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If you understood Psychology, you would understand that what you have labelled as 'bloodthirsty' is actually anger being vented. That is very different to being thirsty for blood.

This is why a distinction is made between behaviour and cognitions. Thinking something doesn't make you it.
 
Renee said:
If you understood Psychology, you would understand that what you have labelled as 'bloodthirsty' is actually anger being vented.
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I'm not changing my mind and I assure you calling a shark simply hungry for eating one man still makes it a man-eater.


That is very different to being thirsty for blood.
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Yeah...right... you should listen to yourself.


This is why a distinction is made between behaviour and cognitions. Thinking something doesn't make you it.
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Actually it does and thank you for wasting my time.

Rather than arguing senselessly on something that is stupid, how about we agree on not trying to promote or talk about any further "wishful thinking." alright?
 
Darkseid said:
I'm not changing my mind and I assure you calling a shark simply hungry for eating one man still makes it a man-eater.
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But that would be a incorrect term. If a shark actually eats a man, then yes, he is a man eater. If he is hungry but does not eat a man, then he is merely hungry. Just like if someone kills another, they are a murderer, however if they simply think in the heat of the moment 'I could just kill you' that does not make them a murderer. It is the act, the behaviour that makes you so!

There is no reason to argue this point because you are simply wrong. How about that instead? I can be condescending and aggressive too, it doesn't take talent.
 
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