Patriarch Calls for Assyrian Administrative Unit in North Iraq

R

Rumtaya

Active member
Brussels (AINA) -- On September 16 the head of the Holy Apostolic Catholic Assyrian Church of the East, Patriarch Dinkha IV, proclaimed after a prayer service in a Syriac Orthodox church that Assyrians must work to establish an Assyrian administered unit in northern Iraq's Nineveh Plain. Patriarch Dinkha emphasized the Assyrian administrative area must comply with the Iraqi constitution and United Nations regulations.

The Patriarch reiterated Assyrians are under attack in the Middle East and it is thus necessary for the Assyrians of different church denominations to unite. Bishop Hazail Soumi, the Assyrian bishop of the Syriac Orthodox Church in Belgium and France, was also present, giving a speech in which he said: "We are one nation but history divided us, it is time we work for unity".

In a show of solidarity the prayer service was conducted by clergy from the Apostolic Church of the East and the Syriac Orthodox Church.

The calls for Assyrian rights in Iraq and Assyrian unity by H.H. Dinkha are adding momentum to requests made public by several other church leaders from different Assyrian church denominations.

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http://www.aina.org/news/20080919024749.htm

Aint that an interesting statment by Mar Dinkha? Its really nice seeing now the Churches working towards eachother. We are one Nation and we should work for a strong unity.



 
If church and religion was what really divided us, maybe they now realize it and are doing their best to reunite it? that is why you see his holiness Mar Dinkha constantly calling for something like this for our people.

ASHOOR
 
I have noticed though that the men in my father's generation are split between Zowaa and the chruch...and within the chruch group you have the mini-sects of the different chruches.

I was first gen born in America, my father is from Baghdad.  One thing that my father said to me that I will never forget is that our generation will be the reason Assyrians will lose their name and their identity.  That was a pretty heavy thing to say and it made me feel guilty but also made me realize that without unity we will perish.  Unity as Assyrians.

Whatever it takes I'm open for it...if the church uniting is the first step...much power to them.  Now they need to be nicer to the Shawah b'yerkha...
 
Well-said, and if we haven't realized that unity is what will help us succeed/fail, by now, we will never get it.

ASHOOR
 
Even here in Canada, it is not that bad actually. I am not talking people with people, because there was never a problem there. I am talking church to church.

This is the 21st century, and there should be no room for such conflicts and bad blood amongst people from the same nation.

ASHOOR
 
graphist said:
I have noticed though that the men in my father's generation are split between Zowaa and the chruch...and within the chruch group you have the mini-sects of the different chruches.

I was first gen born in America, my father is from Baghdad.  One thing that my father said to me that I will never forget is that our generation will be the reason Assyrians will lose their name and their identity.  That was a pretty heavy thing to say and it made me feel guilty but also made me realize that without unity we will perish.  Unity as Assyrians.

Whatever it takes I'm open for it...if the church uniting is the first step...much power to them.  Now they need to be nicer to the Shawah b'yerkha...
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i am with you. i am from the syriac orthodox church. but for me it is not important. i have no problem if am in the assyrian church of the east because this dont change my nationality.
i am for the unity so i make some youtube videos for our people here in germany.
:D here you can watch them:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahhhdhUqKEM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owg5MysI160
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1H8UCHgSos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiGu--KaIcg

shlome lebonoye


 
um... isn't this a little too late?

Also, you have to understand the power-struggle that is faced with our elders, mainly Church Vs. State (Nationalism/Zowaa/etc.).

With them, there is no perception of separation, because there has neven been an 'Assyria' to compare it to.  We were always 'arkheh' (visitors/second class citizens) in our own land with someone providing the 'State' part...all we had was Church (which is why its the greatest power/influence now).

This is a step in the right direction, but more is needed from both sides to help our people.
 
Someone should tell the US administration, it's all good since the Patriarch said it, they have to give it to us now!

 
ASHOOR said:
If church and religion was what really divided us, maybe they now realize it and are doing their best to reunite it? that is why you see his holiness Mar Dinkha constantly calling for something like this for our people.

ASHOOR
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Probably that doesnt seem to important, but guys dont forget our people have a strong tie to their churches and what their patriach says they take it as a command.

Patriachs in our churches are opinion makers...

So when we have more and more people starting to agree on what Zowaa was just preaching the whole time, we will look more united not only within our own groups or churches, but also infront of others. US, Iraq Goverment or the EU.

The Patriach was saying Administrative Unit (according to Aina), that is not what Sarkis Aghajan is running for, cause he and his few people run for an "Assyrian Autonomy" within the KRG.

Thats why I found it interesting, I might be wrong, but we should wait and see......cause more we cant do....

he is tomorrow in wiesbaden/germany. I will be attending it and listin to what he has to tell.
 
Diqlat said:
i expected more ACOE bashing in this thread. but i have to admit im suprised its not as bad as id thought...

i cant talk on behalf of other countries, but here in the UK, we try to unite with shawa b yarkha, but its them that like to distance themselves. we always go to their church if someone passes away that many people knew, but you would never see people from shawa b yarkha in our church.

also, it was the ACOE (mar dinkha) back in the 70s (i think) that said we will allow your church to be valid, along side ours, and allowed them to have self autonomy, becuase the set up of thier church was non-canonical, didnt abide by any church laws. yet its ACOE that always gets doshdishta. the irony in it all....
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What are you tryin to potray, yourself as the Knight of the ACOE? :mrgreen:
 
Diqlat said:
i expected more ACOE bashing in this thread. but i have to admit im suprised its not as bad as id thought...

i cant talk on behalf of other countries, but here in the UK, we try to unite with shawa b yarkha, but its them that like to distance themselves. we always go to their church if someone passes away that many people knew, but you would never see people from shawa b yarkha in our church.

also, it was the ACOE (mar dinkha) back in the 70s (i think) that said we will allow your church to be valid, along side ours, and allowed them to have self autonomy, becuase the set up of thier church was non-canonical, didnt abide by any church laws. yet its ACOE that always gets doshdishta. the irony in it all....
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Its all so interesting. Aside from the rhetoric, the Assyrian Church of the East has accepted the ordinations and consecrations of the Ancient Church of the East 'from Lector to Patriarch' and has also accepted their baptisms, weddings and all other ecclesiastical activities. If you look at the official synod documents and decrees from the 1980s and onwards you will notice that in each document the Assyrian Church of the East have formally written to the Ancient Church of the East requesting that hierarchs from both Holy Synods come together in a joint Synod at the time and place of the Ancient Church of the East's choosing to end this silly schism and come together. These offers have constantly been rejected with a 'maybe in a short period of time' ... 'not yet' attitude. Nonetheless the movement for unity was strong in 1998 and it looked close. A great success was the long-awaited unity of the two branches in India under the leadership of H.H. Mar Dinkha IV where two Metropolitans and one Bishop, H.B. Mar Timateous II Metropolitan, H.B. Dr. Mar Aprem Metropolitan and Bishop Dr. Poulous Mar Poulous joining the Holy Synod of the Assyrian Church of the East. At a joint unity dinner in Chicago around the same time Mar Addai II said something in his speech which was rather out of the ordinary. In his speech he boiled the schism down to one thing (in his mind), Nochiyaye and Tyarayeh. This for me was rather telling about his attitude and that of the Ancient Church of the East towards unity and reveled a lot about the real reasons for the schism, which many until that point had been pointing out.

Regarding His Holiness' call for an administrative unit, H.G. Mar Meelis Zaia AM has written to the United Nations formally requesting it.
 
I don't care about church disputes but I did get married at a Shawah b-yerkha church and got some heat from my own family members.  They didn't even want to come to the wedding because they didn't want to step foot in the church.  That's ridiculous.  I don't know if this dispute is only where I live, or if it is worldwide, but from the things I hear Zowaa is not happy with what is going on with our church leaders and the Kurds in Iraq.  I only know what I have heard and it didn't make me happy, I would have to say that I would side with Zowaa.

We are all Assyrian religion aside (lets figure out those issues when we are sure we are still going to be around), and I believe that we should have a political party governing us.  The church should have no say in our politics and people need to start understanding that it has gotten us nowhere up to now.  As I said earlier if the church is trying new things, much power to them, it does not hurt to try.  But I know, I would rather die Assyrian than live Kurdish. 

I have read some things about people feeling there is a conspiracy, I believe it.  What better way for certain **people** to bury us then to let us get lost among the Muslims.
 
To my knowledge the shawah b'yerkha church more closely follows Orthodox traditions, whereas the 25 is borderline Catholic.  And like Greeks, Serbians, etc. Assyrians should be orthodox by tradition.  Again, not that I give a c**p, just stating it for the sake of argument.
 
In private they will tell you what ever you want to hear... They are biatches.. . In public it depends on where they are located... The bishops in arab countries tend to say they are arab christians... erramean stuff is not really a big deal in the middle east, as far as i know... it is mainly in europe... That's not to say Assyrian stuff is big in the middle east because its not....
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Bingo!  This is what Assyrians are too naive to realize.  They hear bishop so-and-so say something good about Assyrians and they start jumping with joy like little school girls thinking they gained an ally.  They need to understand this middle eastern kissing a** mentality.
 
So has mar bawai, and mar sarhad, and mar......

That's "nice".  Now, ignore and continue working.  Why?  Because even though our people put stock into their opinions in politics, that is the very thing that needs to be changed.  They are not accountable to us should they "change their minds."
 
The only thing I am trying to get across is that I am Assyrian before I am Christian.  It's nice that the church is trying to "unify" people.  But not all Assyrians are involved with the churches, we need something that can reach all ears.
 
graphist said:
The only thing I am trying to get across is that I am Assyrian before I am Christian.  It's nice that the church is trying to "unify" people.  But not all Assyrians are involved with the churches, we need something that can reach all ears.
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No offense but I hate it when people say this.  This is a false-sense of nationalism.  The logic is technical: yes, you were born 'Assyrian' and not baptised until months later, then being 'Christian'...so, does that make you a Pagan baby? haha  Ridiculous.

Look, newsflash, you are BOTH!  Religion is a PART of Culture.  Same as language, food, dancing, arts, literature, etc.  The main problem Assyrians have is that we cannot the two!

Assyrian is WHO you are, Christian is WHAT you are.  :)
 
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