nejepnerast
New member
What is your opinion as an Assyrian about the Kurdish referendum happening in September this year . See the poll above
Are you as an Assyrian for or against Kurdish referendum in Iraq .
- Thread starter nejepnerast
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mrzurnaci
Active member
for it. I'd a bit of a sociology enthusiast and I'm interested to see where a new generation of Kurds who've grown up post-independence would get their newest inspiration and direction from.
Most if not all of modern Kurdish political drive comes from wanting sovereignty. What would post-sovereignty drive consist of? Islamism?
All other reasons why I'm for it is classified.
Most if not all of modern Kurdish political drive comes from wanting sovereignty. What would post-sovereignty drive consist of? Islamism?
All other reasons why I'm for it is classified.
Cascade
Well-known member
For it.
At least they can have a country of their own as Kurdistan is becoming rather stable and becoming developed (but this is NOT to say that Kurds are perfect people). What does it matter for us? I really hate how Assyrians living and prospering in the west are getting mad that Kurds all the way in the Middle East are having a country? I mean, who friggin' cares? You're in America! Many of us want to move out from there already. Our homeland is gone now and we should accept this brutal fact. We are already prospering in the west, and many of the so-called patriotic Assyrians in the homeland are dying just to get here (literally even).
The Romans, the Persians, the Mongols and, Iraqi Arabs have all took our land, and now it's left for Kurds? Come on.
At least they can have a country of their own as Kurdistan is becoming rather stable and becoming developed (but this is NOT to say that Kurds are perfect people). What does it matter for us? I really hate how Assyrians living and prospering in the west are getting mad that Kurds all the way in the Middle East are having a country? I mean, who friggin' cares? You're in America! Many of us want to move out from there already. Our homeland is gone now and we should accept this brutal fact. We are already prospering in the west, and many of the so-called patriotic Assyrians in the homeland are dying just to get here (literally even).
The Romans, the Persians, the Mongols and, Iraqi Arabs have all took our land, and now it's left for Kurds? Come on.
Crocodile Bani
Well-known member
I am against.
Reason 1. It will complete the wiping out of Assyrian influence in the region. Everybody other than Assyrians will be represented in the region. As an Assyrian, it smells of official defeat.
Reason 2. Having a Kurdistan will create more turmoil in the region as there are too many countries around "Kurdistan" who don't like the Kurds merely for being Kurds. As if there isn't enough turmoil in the Middle East, this will create more problems. And when there are problems in the Middle East, we all knows which countries always profit from it. Being an anti-Imperialist/anti-Wahhabist/anti-Zionist, I am concerned about who really gains in the long term from a Kurdistan. The Kurds are just pawns (just like Assyrians for many years) for imperialists.
Reason 1. It will complete the wiping out of Assyrian influence in the region. Everybody other than Assyrians will be represented in the region. As an Assyrian, it smells of official defeat.
Reason 2. Having a Kurdistan will create more turmoil in the region as there are too many countries around "Kurdistan" who don't like the Kurds merely for being Kurds. As if there isn't enough turmoil in the Middle East, this will create more problems. And when there are problems in the Middle East, we all knows which countries always profit from it. Being an anti-Imperialist/anti-Wahhabist/anti-Zionist, I am concerned about who really gains in the long term from a Kurdistan. The Kurds are just pawns (just like Assyrians for many years) for imperialists.
nejepnerast
New member
I certainly respect everyones opinion even if they are against the independent of Kurdistan and there are certainly valid concerns , but Iraq is radicalized completely and the conflict between shia and sunna will last another 100 years if not more . The minorities will continue being the victims of such conflict which creates a perfect ground for continued migration of Assyrian to the west . No one certainly would wants live in a region where there is explosions on daily basis .
Secondly what possible rights can Assyrian secure with Iraq ? would Assyrian secure any form of autonomy within iraq ?
Secondly what possible rights can Assyrian secure with Iraq ? would Assyrian secure any form of autonomy within iraq ?
Mr. Tambourine Man
New member
Cascade said:
My friend can be the CEO and I'll be his secretary.
mrzurnaci
Active member
Cascade said:
exactly, why do Kurds need Nineveh Plains when KRG has enough land to house millions of Kurds in and of itself? If you build up the cities and put condos and apartment complexes (not even high apartments, think 3 story apartment complex) you can house maybe 70-100 million people.
nejepnerast
New member
mrzurnaci . I think i did explain the social composition of Nineveh plain in a previous post , but the trend here seem to be that Nineveh plain is full of Assyrian and everyone believes that .mrzurnaci said:
Assyrian are not majority in the plains and they have the lowest number among the minorities in Nineveh plain . Assyrian vote is obvious as seen in this poll, but it is not up to them what happens in Nineveh plain .
I speak from a neutral positon , so i hope you do not get offended .
nejepnerast
New member
Cascade said:
Yes , but autonomous region within Kurdistan or Iraq ?
mrzurnaci
Active member
nejepnerast said:
Assyrians make up 40% of the Nineveh Plains... why do you keep downplaying 40%? That's almost half the damn population.
Everybody else in the NP are Yezids, Turkmens, Shabaks, and then (Muslim) Kurds.
What percentage are Kurds in NP? Turkmens? Shabaks? Yezids?
Waht about Yezidis who want the NP to be autonomous? There's Turkmen and Shabaks who support this.
You make it sound like Kurds like yourself are intentionally being an obstacle to something Assyrians deserve for over 2600 years.
Whether you think it's wrong or not, we're gonna get autonomy eventually. we've been trying for 2600 years and we'll try for another 2600 years if necessary.
What have we ever done to the kurds? The kurds have through history killed us millions of times and we didnt Do anything and when we want autonomy and accept a kurdish country still they wont allow it, they are so mean, at first l thought the Kurdish were nice muslims but how this is going l dont think they are. Everybody deserve their own country, it doesnt matter who you are, what religion you got, all. And they wont let us have a small place like the nineveh plains ffs! Probably they would kill us all if they had opportunity but they cant because other nations are watching, so they play good muslims to get a country of their own. Thats how l see it, even non muslim kurd like that guy nejer something wont allow a autonomy for assyrians, the first people in mesopotamia considering no ancient people from the past lives in todays world, we are the descendants of mesopotamias and we dammit deserve a country or autonomy!
nejepnerast
New member
Bro , Kurds is the least of your problem and kurdish politicians said over and over that they are FOR Assyrian and Chaldean autonomy and self administrations . In fact i believe that kurds wants nothing more than establishing an Assyrian state as a belt to separate them completely from arabs .Nemrud said:
what I'm stating is just my personal opinion and I just do not see that happening considering the assyrian numbers in NP .
nejepnerast
New member
mrzurnaci said:
mrzurnaci , I stopped at 40% . where did you get this number ? the entire Assyrian population in iraq ,I mean the whole iraq is by all estimate is 300-400 thousands , so how does that make 40% of NP ?
https://www.google.ca/#q=assyrian+population+in+iraq
mrzurnaci
Active member
nejepnerast said:
where did I get 40% from your FELLOW KURDS -> http://www.rudaw.net/english/middleeast/iraq/24012014
"The Nineveh Plain has the largest population of Christians in Iraq. They make up around 40 percent of the population of the planned new province. They now live in a so-called disputed area: Iraqi territory that Kurdistan claims for its autonomous region."
By Judit Neurink 24/1/2014
40% is not a small number, that's almost half the damn population. 40% of NP is one people.
Here's another comparison. Lebanon is 40% Christian and 60% Muslim but the Muslim population is divided into Shi'a and Sunni (both 30%).
Also, why is it that Kurds get autonomy with the KRG when Iraqi Kurds only make up 26% of the population? From the CIA factbook, Kurds make up 15%-20% of Iraq's total population. -> https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2075.html#iz
you're showing clear bias here now.
Mr. Tambourine Man
New member
nejepnerast said:
Kurds support Chaldean organisations because they know they are divisive and harmful to the overall Assyrian cause.
You are lying to yourself or just plain naive if you think Kurds will truly do anything for the betterment of us Assyrians.
nejepnerast
New member
mrzurnaci said:
Oh , Ok , so you English is bad .
It is 40% of the Planned (does not exist yet ) new province . So this imaginary province will include the Assyrian villages and few other minorities and Assyrian population within this Planned ( does not exist yet) province will constitute 40 % . It is not talking about assyrian being 40% of entire NP . I would be surprised if they are more than 3 % of NP .
nejepnerast
New member
Mr. Tambourine Man said:
I do not believe Kurds will do anything if it is not in there interest . No one does anything if it is not in there interest and this is the reality . Look at the results of the poll and tell me why would a typical kurds care about the betterment of Assyrian ? It is naive to think that kurds will do all the work and simply hand the keys to Assyrian .
Mr. Tambourine Man
New member
Yes, it must be tiring and exhausting for the Kurds to steal Assyrian lands, claim Assyrian history and disseminate lies about the Assyrians. You're right, the Kurdish workload is tiresome.
Look at the polls yourself, those for the Kurdish referendum are only one behind those against it - unless of course you find one vote, or any vote, against the Kurdish referendum enough reason not to help the indigenous people of those lands. I suppose you'd want all of us to vote, better yet, fund the establishment of a Kurdish state.
Additionally, your justification is stupid. You legitimise the Kurdish funding and proliferation of the Chaldean identity because 'there is an interest there'; what you're basically saying is that the Kurds realise how advantageous it is for them to lie about a Chaldean identity because it'll prohibit the unification of Assyrians.
Look at the polls yourself, those for the Kurdish referendum are only one behind those against it - unless of course you find one vote, or any vote, against the Kurdish referendum enough reason not to help the indigenous people of those lands. I suppose you'd want all of us to vote, better yet, fund the establishment of a Kurdish state.
Additionally, your justification is stupid. You legitimise the Kurdish funding and proliferation of the Chaldean identity because 'there is an interest there'; what you're basically saying is that the Kurds realise how advantageous it is for them to lie about a Chaldean identity because it'll prohibit the unification of Assyrians.
nejepnerast
New member
Mr. Tambourine Man said:
Sorry Mr.Tambourine , I'm actually recently left Kurdistan and I'm not aware of any land being confiscated by KRG , Can you shed some light on that by providing some evidence ? or Are you talking about the Ancient history ?
claim Assyrian history ? Just to make it fun , I promise I will send you the biggest gift I could possibly afford if you can prove this
. Kurd have never ever made such claims and would never ever do for very obvious reasons . Mr. Tambourine Man said:
At the end of the day majority are either do not care or opposed it and I have ZERO issues with that as an individual . But let us be frank here , the animosity among our people is real and honestly i was not even aware of it when i was in Kurdistan . As I said I have no personal issue with Assyrian Vote and I understand it to a certain extend , but let me ask you this . how would you feel if the result of the this vote was for the establishment of autonomous region for Assyrian in Kurdistan and majority of Kurds opposed it ?
I do not believe an independent Kurdistan will have any effect on the Assyrian identity and there is a real possibility that Assyrian could finally get their rights and establish a region on their own , Yet majority is voting No ! Do not you find that a bit strange ? Frankly I'm just curious and I want to understand .
I never talked about Chaldean , so I have no clue what you are saying .Chaldean as far as I know have their own identity and wants nothing to do with Assyrian . Are you claiming that Chaldean are Assyrian are the same and some how the kurds are the reason for your separation ? oh ok i get , you are upset because Kurds accepting the Chaldean identity and not telling them that they are Assyrian and that is causing the division among Assyrians including Chaldean who are Assyrian , but just not smart enough to know ?Mr. Tambourine Man said:
nejepnerast
New member
mrzurnaci said:
and I have no issue if they decided to call themselves Assyrian tommorrow . I met many Chaldean in Dohuk and honestly if it is up to me I will nominate a Chaldean to be the first president of Kurdistan if it ever get established . Hell I will make half of the parliament Chaldean and sleep like a baby knowing Kurdistan is in Good hand because of kind of people Chaldean are .
Khili libokh Chaldanaya :bigarmhug:
mrzurnaci
Active member
nejepnerast said:
Also, why would the KRG make it public that they have groups of people stealing land? Assyrians aren't the only victims either, we Assyrians have also found out that Armenians and non-political Kurdish tribes were victimized in having their land taken as well.
What land was taken? farming land.
nejepnerast
New member
mrzurnaci said:
Mrzurnaci , let us be realistic please and not rely on rumeurs or my cousin said , my uncle said . Fine KRG would not make it public ,but what about the owner of the land ?
Show me a farmer that KRG took their land from . I mean seriously sometimes I feel you guys live on another planet . There is law and order in Kurdistan and no one would dare to take someone else land .
The public land is another matter and KRG has the right to develop as it see it fit no matter where it is even in the assyrian areas . The problem is the allergy assyrian have towards kurds , On one hand they want the right to buy land , homes everywhere in Kurdistan , but they want to keep kurds within 10 miles from the nearest village . Land in Kurdistan is expensive and developing public land will happen whether people like or not because it belongs to all people not just the Assyrian .