Are Persians the good guys?

Etain

Member
Most empires,even ones not nearly as evil as the Ottomans,have at least a few massacres or atrocities in their histories.
However, I am drawing a blank for anything especially awful the Persians did. Granted, I doubt the people they conquered were particularly fond of them,but still.
Are there any notable massacres or things like that Persians did in antiquity?
I have not found much after a cursory source.
They seem like pretty chill bros.
 
so far, the only bad thing Persians ever did to us was persecute us for being Christian back when Christianity was first forming.

The reason for this was that the Roman empire was being portrayed as Christian during this time and the Persians were at war with Rome.

Thus they started seeing Christians as sympathetic with Rome. However, this all stops when Assyrians created their own church that was separate from the Roman churches.
 
They went jihad on us too during WW1. For details check the book "Flickering light of Asia". Assyrians led by Agha Petros had many battles with them in North Iran and they were partially responsible for the assasination of Mar Shimun XXI Benyamin since they collaborated with the Kurds. A tayo is still a tayo.
 
Persian good guys ? I would say no, and I think, generally, non Arab muslims tend to be more "hardcore" muslims than arabs, just like the Kurds.
According to Wikipedia:
In 1743, Tel Keppe was looted and burned by the armies of the Persian leader Nader Shah.In the early 18th century, Persians under the leadership of Nader Shah invaded the Mosul region and most of the inhabitants of Baghdida escaped to Mosul with all their valuables, in accordance with the governor's orders. Mosul was harassed and then besieged for months.

In their literature and writings, the Assyrians of Baghdida remember vividly the raids of the Persians and Kurds on their village and churches.

In 1738, the Persian king sent his army under Nargis Khan to Assyria where he destroyed many villages in Nineveh plain.

How many Assyrians fled Iran because of the daily intimidation to which they were subject to (Just like in any other fucking state in the middle east) ?
Maybe those from there can tell their story...
From this article:What it Means to be Assyrians
My other grandfather has origins in Urmia, Iran. He left after his brother was murdered by thugs and their family?s lands stolen with no recourse to law???a theme popular among Assyrians and their lands
 
Joe25 said:
They went jihad on us too during WW1. For details check the book "Flickering light of Asia". Assyrians led by Agha Petros had many battles with them in North Iran and they were partially responsible for the assasination of Mar Shimun XXI Benyamin since they collaborated with the Kurds. A tayo is still a tayo.

wait, the Persians actually helped kill us in the Genocide? Why have I read that they helped Armenians though?
 
mrzurnaci said:
wait, the Persians actually helped kill us in the Genocide? Why have I read that they helped Armenians though?

I could try to add some details when I'm home later today. Could you also provide info on the latter please? It sounds like a temporary alliance to fight the Ottomans as Persians had their issues with them as well.
 
mrzurnaci said:
wait, the Persians actually helped kill us in the Genocide? Why have I read that they helped Armenians though?
Currently at least,Iranian and Armenian relations have been cordial and they are allies, assumed its been like that for some time.
 
Joe25 said:
I could try to add some details when I'm home later today. Could you also provide info on the latter please? It sounds like a temporary alliance to fight the Ottomans as Persians had their issues with them as well.

I read it on the armenian genocide article in wikipedia and the assyrian genocide article on wikipedia.
 
Just a few notes I've been digging up:

-Urmia is where many Assyrians lived in North Iran. They were successful with their villages, had some wealth etc. During the genocide in WW1 the Persians tried to wipe all christians out but forces led by Agha Petros stopped this from happening(though many villagers lost their lives) and took control of parts of the city. There are severol old photographs of this as well in the book.
-American Reverend David H. Oraham who was a lifeline to Assyrians in Iran was assasinated. The way they ended him was beyond barbaric.
-American compounds for missionairies, consulates and even a college were attacked brutally by Persian forces and all the wealth stolen. Assyrians had to seek refugee in these buildings later and many were still slaughtered. Disease broke out too. It's horrid to read about.
-Patriach Mar Shimon had tried many arrangements for peace with the higher ups of Iran including the Prince in Tabriz. All to no avail.
-Persian authorities conspired with the Kurdish militias lead by Simkoo(This animal had been treated by christian physicians before btw) to assasinate the patriach Mar Shimon in Salmas. This was after all the peace talks with the Persians who gained his trust somehow.

There are many details. Basicely it was a full blown jihad against Assyrians and all christians in Iran. It's sad that Agha Petros and the Patriach were trying to so hard to send their Assyrian militias around but massacress were spread out over many distant villages and towns. Not to mention that all of this was happening all over the Ottoman empire at the time too. These facts make it quite easy to believe the huge numbers of casualties of the Seyfo. We almost didn't stand a chance.

We didn't have enough forces to protect us all even though the ones we had were more skilled and effective than all the islamists, we were completely outnumbered and our only hopes were our alliances with the Russian troops, The British(betrayed us many times too) and the small Armenian armies who teamed up with us.

Turks, Kurds, Arabs, Persians, basicely every muslim group had a hand in our genocide.
 
Joe25 said:
Just a few notes I've been digging up:

-Urmia is where many Assyrians lived in North Iran. They were successful with their villages, had some wealth etc. During the genocide in WW1 the Persians tried to wipe all christians out but forces led by Agha Petros stopped this from happening(though many villagers lost their lives) and took control of parts of the city. There are severol old photographs of this as well in the book.
-American Reverend David H. Oraham who was a lifeline to Assyrians in Iran was assasinated. The way they ended him was beyond barbaric.
-American compounds for missionairies, consulates and even a college were attacked brutally by Persian forces and all the wealth stolen. Assyrians had to seek refugee in these buildings later and many were still slaughtered. Disease broke out too. It's horrid to read about.
-Patriach Mar Shimon had tried many arrangements for peace with the higher ups of Iran including the Prince in Tabriz. All to no avail.
-Persian authorities conspired with the Kurdish militias lead by Simkoo(This animal had been treated by christian physicians before btw) to assasinate the patriach Mar Shimon in Salmas. This was after all the peace talks with the Persians who gained his trust somehow.

There are many details. Basicely it was a full blown jihad against Assyrians and all christians in Iran. It's sad that Agha Petros and the Patriach were trying to so hard to send their Assyrian militias around but massacress were spread out over many distant villages and towns. Not to mention that all of this was happening all over the Ottoman empire at the time too. These facts make it quite easy to believe the huge numbers of casualties of the Seyfo. We almost didn't stand a chance.

We didn't have enough forces to protect us all even though the ones we had were more skilled and effective than all the islamists, we were completely outnumbered and our only hopes were our alliances with the Russian troops, The British(betrayed us many times too) and the small Armenian armies who teamed up with us.

Turks, Kurds, Arabs, Persians, basicely every muslim group had a hand in our genocide.

This is true. Also, I would like to add what Ph.D  Arianne Ishaya, Professor in the Anthropology department at De Anza College, Cupertino, CA has stated regarding Assyrians from Urmia, Iran.
              "With the beginning of WWI, the rate of literacy among the Assyrians of Urmia was estimated at 80%.(9 )This is a remarkably high rate of literacy for the time even by the standards of an urbanized center in the West, let alone a rural area in the Middle East. At the time, there were more Assyrian physicians in Urmia than all of Iran; Assyrian professionals under the supervision of the foreign missionaries staffed all missionary schools, newspapers and hospitals.(10)"

Ishaya referenced:
9: C. Issawi, The Economic History of Iran: 1900-1914, vol. 1 (1971), 24.
10: H. Murre-van den Berg, ?The Missionaries? Assistants,? JAAS 10, no. 2 (1996): 10.

See her entire article at: http://www.nineveh.com/Assyrians%20in%20the%20History%20of%20Urmia,%20Iran.html

Although Iran (like any Muslims nation) was filled with hostility and backwardness, I would also like to add that Iranians were far more more benign than other Muslims. Some Iranians did support Kurds, Arabs, Azeris and Turks in the Assyrian genocide, but there are a few notable instances were they tried to protect Assyrians from those people. I believe Iranians today are still like this -they definitely have problems but generally, they are good people who have some terrible beliefs based on their Islamic ideologies.

When Turks got a hold of Urmia (granting access to those ethnic minorities to attack), the Assyrian community there was devastated, the people were massacred and deported having many of those deportees dying as they traversed mostly towards eastern Iran. Some made it to eastern Iran, others eventually returned to Urmia, but the society there had significantly lost it's size and therefore it's capacity to function as effectively as it did before.

Before the Assyrian genocide, in 1840, Urmian Assyrians acquired the first printing press in Iran and used it to make several publications in Classical Syriac.
 
Sharukinu said:
I would also like to add that Iranians were far more more benign than other Muslims. Some Iranians did support Kurds, Arabs, Azeris and Turks in the Assyrian genocide, but there are a few notable instances were they tried to protect Assyrians from those people.

Thanks for the additional info, can you add more details on this part though? The book I have never mentions any muslims helping Assyrians during the genocide though I believe it must have happened at some level as extremely rare as it was.
 
Joe25 said:
Thanks for the additional info, can you add more details on this part though? The book I have never mentions any muslims helping Assyrians during the genocide though I believe it must have happened at some level as extremely rare as it was.

I honestly can't remember where I read about it but I recall there being multiple reports that confirm it. Some Iranian locals were helping their Assyrian neighbours during the genocide. Those Iranians were not strangers, nor being supported by their government -they acted out of good faith due to living among those Assyrians and having friendships with them.
 
Shahin said:
Persian good guys ? I would say no, and I think, generally, non Arab muslims tend to be more "hardcore" muslims than arabs, just like the Kurds.
I agree with this. Non-Arab Muslims are generally more malicious, but in a discreet or subtle manner.

With that being said, I'd still prefer Iranians over Saudis and a number of Gulf Arabs.
 
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