Author Topic: What happend to the babylonians  (Read 507 times)

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Offline Nemrud

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What happend to the babylonians
« on: January 16, 2018, 07:33:28 PM »
Who are their descendants? i mean l know we were close to them but what happended to them? where are they living now? is it in southern iraq or what? are they arabs now?



Offline SonOfAssyria

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2018, 12:31:24 AM »
Im pretty sure they just assimilated into Assyrians. I want to hear what other people here say about this however.
"Their enemies had realized their national potential long before the Assyrians themselves. The enemy was not afraid of good farmers, good parents, good church-going parishioners...the enemy was afraid of Assyrians wrapped in nationhood." ~ Mount Semele, Ivan Kakovitch

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2018, 01:01:04 AM »
Im pretty sure they just assimilated into Assyrians. I want to hear what other people here say about this however.

interestingly, Babylon was abandoned after the death of Alexander or it at least downsized into a village after the Greeks built Seleucia (Slookhiya), obviously this led to the death of the Babylonian identity considering that Babylons identity was of itself as a city rather than its empires.

so by the time of the medieval ages, Babylonians and Assyrian populations merged into one which explains why the Persians renamed Mesopotamia as Asuristan.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 01:02:00 AM by mrzurnaci »

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2018, 01:01:04 AM »

Offline SonOfAssyria

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2018, 01:31:59 AM »
interestingly, Babylon was abandoned after the death of Alexander or it at least downsized into a village after the Greeks built Seleucia (Slookhiya), obviously this led to the death of the Babylonian identity considering that Babylons identity was of itself as a city rather than its empires.

so by the time of the medieval ages, Babylonians and Assyrian populations merged into one which explains why the Persians renamed Mesopotamia as Asuristan.

So I was right :P Was the village of Babylon eventually destroyed or was it renamed?
"Their enemies had realized their national potential long before the Assyrians themselves. The enemy was not afraid of good farmers, good parents, good church-going parishioners...the enemy was afraid of Assyrians wrapped in nationhood." ~ Mount Semele, Ivan Kakovitch

Offline Nemrud

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2018, 07:32:30 AM »
interestingly, Babylon was abandoned after the death of Alexander or it at least downsized into a village after the Greeks built Seleucia (Slookhiya), obviously this led to the death of the Babylonian identity considering that Babylons identity was of itself as a city rather than its empires.

so by the time of the medieval ages, Babylonians and Assyrian populations merged into one which explains why the Persians renamed Mesopotamia as Asuristan.

if thats true, then why are they saying the modern chaldeans have no connection to the babylonians? l know they were assyrians but if we merged as one then shouldnt we also have connection to babylon?
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 07:33:16 AM by Nemrud »

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2018, 10:35:52 AM »
if thats true, then why are they saying the modern chaldeans have no connection to the babylonians? l know they were assyrians but if we merged as one then shouldnt we also have connection to babylon?

because we have a GENETIC connection to Bawel and the ancient Bawelnaya/Bawelnoyo. But we don't have a CULTURAL connection that allows us to say "we are Babylonians", not to mention that modern Chaldeans and the Chaldean church originated in Assyria, not Babylon.

Yes, the ancient Babylonian blood is within us but we are Assyrian, not just because of our Assyrian blood, but our cultural and religious connection to Assyria.

Offline SonOfAssyria

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2018, 10:49:05 AM »
if thats true, then why are they saying the modern chaldeans have no connection to the babylonians? l know they were assyrians but if we merged as one then shouldnt we also have connection to babylon?


We are saying that modern Chaldeans have no connection to the ancient Chaldeans. Babylonian and Chaldean are not the same thing. Heck, I'm not even 100% sure if "Chaldean" even refers to a race of people. I've read that the term Chaldeans was a title given to those who specialised in prophecy, astrology and sorcery. It could be they were a race of people and just specialised in all that but I think that "Chaldean" is just a profession. Also, we do have a connection to Babylon.

Look at these videos by youtuber MrAssyrianPride:





This guy also has some pretty cool videos about Assyrian identity, you should check those out too if you want.

"Their enemies had realized their national potential long before the Assyrians themselves. The enemy was not afraid of good farmers, good parents, good church-going parishioners...the enemy was afraid of Assyrians wrapped in nationhood." ~ Mount Semele, Ivan Kakovitch

Offline Nemrud

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2018, 11:30:20 AM »
because we have a GENETIC connection to Bawel and the ancient Bawelnaya/Bawelnoyo. But we don't have a CULTURAL connection that allows us to say "we are Babylonians", not to mention that modern Chaldeans and the Chaldean church originated in Assyria, not Babylon.

Yes, the ancient Babylonian blood is within us but we are Assyrian, not just because of our Assyrian blood, but our cultural and religious connection to Assyria.

I never said we didnt have babylonian blood, l do know the ancient assyrians where a mixture of people.

Offline Nemrud

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2018, 11:33:13 AM »
You know what would be awesome, l know we are the closets to mesopotamians, even babylonians, so if we one day rebuild babylon we could call the assyrians of babylon babylonians. Then we have created back the babylonians hehehe

Offline Cascade

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2018, 02:21:46 AM »
Like Akkadians, Babylonian descendants are mostly Assyrian and few Iraqi Arabs (I know Assyrians get fumed when I say some Iraqi Arabs do have ancient Mesopotamian blood, but let's face it some would have unfortunately intermixed and become Arabized).
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline SonOfAssyria

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2018, 03:20:48 AM »
Like Akkadians, Babylonian descendants are mostly Assyrian and few Iraqi Arabs (I know Assyrians get fumed when I say some Iraqi Arabs do have ancient Mesopotamian blood, but let's face it some would have unfortunately intermixed and become Arabized).

It's mostly just some of the Northen Iraqi Arabs that have some Assyrian blood
"Their enemies had realized their national potential long before the Assyrians themselves. The enemy was not afraid of good farmers, good parents, good church-going parishioners...the enemy was afraid of Assyrians wrapped in nationhood." ~ Mount Semele, Ivan Kakovitch

Offline Cascade

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2018, 10:22:50 PM »
It's mostly just some of the Northen Iraqi Arabs that have some Assyrian blood
Yep. As a whole, maybe roughly 15%-25% of Iraqi Arabs would have Assyrian ancestry. It's really telling, because some tend to be look rather Levantine (but then again, they could also be Kurdish Arabs).

I still hear of Assyrians, even in my extended family, who have married Iraqi Arabs. So if this has happened in my family, I'm pretty sure it's happened in others.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline SonOfAssyria

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2018, 04:21:29 AM »
Yep. As a whole, maybe roughly 15%-25% of Iraqi Arabs would have Assyrian ancestry. It's really telling, because some tend to be look rather Levantine (but then again, they could also be Kurdish Arabs).

I still hear of Assyrians, even in my extended family, who have married Iraqi Arabs. So if this has happened in my family, I'm pretty sure it's happened in others.

Assyrians marrying Iraqi Arabs? Are you sure of this? Were they always Christian or did they convert?
"Their enemies had realized their national potential long before the Assyrians themselves. The enemy was not afraid of good farmers, good parents, good church-going parishioners...the enemy was afraid of Assyrians wrapped in nationhood." ~ Mount Semele, Ivan Kakovitch

Offline Cascade

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2018, 08:40:56 PM »
Assyrians marrying Iraqi Arabs? Are you sure of this? Were they always Christian or did they convert?
It has happened in my extended family (granparents sister, dad's sister, etc) and I've heard of other Assyrians marrying Iraqi and even Lebanese Muslims. It's uncommon, but it's not unheard of.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline SonOfAssyria

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2018, 04:18:08 AM »
It has happened in my extended family (granparents sister, dad's sister, etc) and I've heard of other Assyrians marrying Iraqi and even Lebanese Muslims. It's uncommon, but it's not unheard of.

wow
"Their enemies had realized their national potential long before the Assyrians themselves. The enemy was not afraid of good farmers, good parents, good church-going parishioners...the enemy was afraid of Assyrians wrapped in nationhood." ~ Mount Semele, Ivan Kakovitch

Offline Cascade

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #15 on: March 01, 2018, 02:26:49 AM »
wow
Honestly, it's shameful. Not sure what they were thinking.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline SonOfAssyria

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2018, 05:45:45 AM »
Honestly, it's shameful. Not sure what they were thinking.

Neither do I. Honestly, I'm not trying to shame your family or anything, but I think it was very stupid of them to do that. I'm actually baffled as to why an Assyrian would marry a Muslim. Marrying a non-Assyrian is one thing, but marrying a Muslim is much worse in my eyes. It's not like theres not enough Assyrians who would make good potential spouses out there... Are any of those relatives of yours still married to Muslims to this day? Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if they've divorced.
"Their enemies had realized their national potential long before the Assyrians themselves. The enemy was not afraid of good farmers, good parents, good church-going parishioners...the enemy was afraid of Assyrians wrapped in nationhood." ~ Mount Semele, Ivan Kakovitch

Offline Cascade

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Re: What happend to the babylonians
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2018, 11:59:42 PM »
Neither do I. Honestly, I'm not trying to shame your family or anything, but I think it was very stupid of them to do that. I'm actually baffled as to why an Assyrian would marry a Muslim. Marrying a non-Assyrian is one thing, but marrying a Muslim is much worse in my eyes. It's not like theres not enough Assyrians who would make good potential spouses out there... Are any of those relatives of yours still married to Muslims to this day? Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if they've divorced.
The one on my grandfather's side is dead (both her and husband). My grandpa was estranged from her until death.

My father's sides is widowed (her Muslim husband was shot to death, I think). Her children are practicing Muslims (why oh why didn't the mum try converting them since she's an Assyrian Christian?). My cousin's father is Turkish btw and I'm not sure he is Muslim or not. :/
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

 

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