Author Topic: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic  (Read 2370 times)

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Offline asuryoyo

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Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« on: July 07, 2014, 03:29:30 PM »
Shlomo xal'eykhon/Shlama alokhun

I had a question if anyone knows. Everyone know that both akkadian and aramaic are semitic languages and relatives. I had a theory that Syriac today must be a mix between aramaic and akkadian because our forefathers were bilingual and spoke both language. Maybe this Can be the reason in why there is a lot of akkadian in Syriac because syriac prospered under us, right? I have a list which I have created and worked with a couple of years just for fun. I made a list with syriac words which has their root in the akkadian language. I'm up on around nearly 2000 by now. The syriac language has always been consider as an aramaic dialect but I think its strange espacially when you find so much akkadian in it. So this make think of 2 theories. 1: aramaic and akkadian are close to eachother like spanish and portugues and its normal to share same words with the same root.
2: aramaic and akkadian are in distance from eachothers and the only reason we have a language with akkadian words and a language with akkadian subtratum is because we speak the aramaic which was mixed with akkadian and the product of that is the language of Edessa: suryoyo/suroyo/surayt/suret.

If anyone know a little about this and helped me to understand more about My precious language i would appreciate it very much

Tawdi sagi



Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2014, 04:37:24 PM »
Akkadian has alot of Sumerian loanwords.

Syriac is classified as an Aramaic dialect because Syriac expands on Aramaic grammar, phonology, etc while it simply uses Akkadian loanwords.

The ancient Assyrians were partially bilingual but many switched to Aramaic because the Aramaic alphabet was easier to read and memorize compared to Cuneiform and that Aramaic was close to Akkadian so it could be easily learned and understood.

Offline Gwhergis

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2014, 06:09:12 PM »
Here is a passage from the epic of gilgamesh. i don't hear the similarities


Assyrian Voice Forum

Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2014, 06:09:12 PM »

Offline asuryoyo

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2014, 09:11:14 PM »
Akkadian has alot of Sumerian loanwords.

Syriac is classified as an Aramaic dialect because Syriac expands on Aramaic grammar, phonology, etc while it simply uses Akkadian loanwords.

The ancient Assyrians were partially bilingual but many switched to Aramaic because the Aramaic alphabet was easier to read and memorize compared to Cuneiform and that Aramaic was close to Akkadian so it could be easily learned and understood.

You have a point ahuno, it sounds reasonable because I have heard that it was easy for the akkadian speaking citizens to learn aramaic just because it was close as you said. When strangers asks about My language I tell them that I speak assyrian aramaic and by that I mean that the language syriac is like a language of a mix with aramaic and akkadian = syriac. Am I totally wrong or is it more correct to just say i'm speaking syriac or aramaic? When I looked at passion of the christ I noticed that syriac had a LOT more akkadian influence than the galilean aramaic. Example the ending "o" instead of "a". I may be wrong but I just Want to feel 100% sure about the knowledge of My language.
Shlome

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2014, 10:43:06 PM »
You have a point ahuno, it sounds reasonable because I have heard that it was easy for the akkadian speaking citizens to learn aramaic just because it was close as you said. When strangers asks about My language I tell them that I speak assyrian aramaic and by that I mean that the language syriac is like a language of a mix with aramaic and akkadian = syriac. Am I totally wrong or is it more correct to just say i'm speaking syriac or aramaic? When I looked at passion of the christ I noticed that syriac had a LOT more akkadian influence than the galilean aramaic. Example the ending "o" instead of "a". I may be wrong but I just Want to feel 100% sure about the knowledge of My language.
Shlome

the Aramaic spoken as "suryoyo" is classified as Turoyo.

According to modern scholars, real Aramean people (yes they are real but they number 70,000 i think) speak Western Neo-Aramaic.

All Assyrians, even those part of the Chaldean Catholic church and Syriac orthodox speak Eastern Neo-Aramaic, even Turoyo is classified as Eastern.

If an Assyrian from the Syriac orthodox church spoke to an Aramean and both used their form of Aramaics, they would never understand each other.

Western Aramaic is significantly different from Eastern.

Offline asuryoyo

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2014, 05:52:21 PM »
the Aramaic spoken as "suryoyo" is classified as Turoyo.

According to modern scholars, real Aramean people (yes they are real but they number 70,000 i think) speak Western Neo-Aramaic.

All Assyrians, even those part of the Chaldean Catholic church and Syriac orthodox speak Eastern Neo-Aramaic, even Turoyo is classified as Eastern.

If an Assyrian from the Syriac orthodox church spoke to an Aramean and both used their form of Aramaics, they would never understand each other.

Western Aramaic is significantly different from Eastern.

Tawdi l'fonoyo dilokh! Very interesting i'm starting to understand now. I have friends that Said before that the Biggest proof that aramaic and syriac are distinctive languages is that western aramaic is hard to be understood therefore they used this to clarify their statements. But now I Know that syriac is based on aramaic grammar with akkadian loanwords and that even western and eastern sounds different its still aramaic but with various groups in one language tree. About the loanwords from akkadian, are they loanwords or have they always been in the language because akkadian was our language in the past before we dropped it for aramaic? What I mean is that maybe we shouldnt classify them as loanwords but words that has always existed? What do you think ahuno?

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2014, 07:10:33 PM »
Tawdi l'fonoyo dilokh! Very interesting i'm starting to understand now. I have friends that Said before that the Biggest proof that aramaic and syriac are distinctive languages is that western aramaic is hard to be understood therefore they used this to clarify their statements. But now I Know that syriac is based on aramaic grammar with akkadian loanwords and that even western and eastern sounds different its still aramaic but with various groups in one language tree. About the loanwords from akkadian, are they loanwords or have they always been in the language because akkadian was our language in the past before we dropped it for aramaic? What I mean is that maybe we shouldnt classify them as loanwords but words that has always existed? What do you think ahuno?

Loanwords, Akkadian is a whole different language. Akkadian sounds very close to Arabic. Strange part is that Akkadian didn't Heth and didn't have 'Ayn but it has Teth and Sadhe sounds...

Here's a few examples.
English - Akkadian
Akkadian language - lišānum akkadītum
King - šarrum
Strong - dannoom
thief - šarrāq
son - mār
dog - kalab
governer - šakin
Alliances - salīmātum
land - māt-am (this is where we get the word "matha" ܡܵܬ݂ܵܐ (village) from. )
wide, open - rapšum
singular masculine "you" - atta
singular feminine "you" - atti
who? - mannu
what? - mīnū
which? - ayyu
number 1 - ištēn
2 - šinā
3 - šalāš
4 - erbē
5 - ḫamiš
6 - šediš
7 - sebē
8 - samānē
9 - tešē
10 - ešer
60 - šūš
100 - meʾat, māt
1000 - līm
erbē aššātum (four wives) (male numeral), meʾat ālānū (100 towns)

Here's some loanwords FROM Aramaic to Akkadian back to Syriac xD
erēqu - ܥܪܲܩܵܐ 'eraqah - to flee, run
qaṭālu - ܩܛܠܐ - to kill

Offline asuryoyo

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2014, 09:07:55 PM »
Loanwords, Akkadian is a whole different language. Akkadian sounds very close to Arabic. Strange part is that Akkadian didn't Heth and didn't have 'Ayn but it has Teth and Sadhe sounds...

Here's a few examples.
English - Akkadian
Akkadian language - lišānum akkadītum
King - šarrum
Strong - dannoom
thief - šarrāq
son - mār
dog - kalab
governer - šakin
Alliances - salīmātum
land - māt-am (this is where we get the word "matha" ܡܵܬ݂ܵܐ (village) from. )
wide, open - rapšum
singular masculine "you" - atta
singular feminine "you" - atti
who? - mannu
what? - mīnū
which? - ayyu
number 1 - ištēn
2 - šinā
3 - šalāš
4 - erbē
5 - ḫamiš
6 - šediš
7 - sebē
8 - samānē
9 - tešē
10 - ešer
60 - šūš
100 - meʾat, māt
1000 - līm
erbē aššātum (four wives) (male numeral), meʾat ālānū (100 towns)

Here's some loanwords FROM Aramaic to Akkadian back to Syriac xD
erēqu - ܥܪܲܩܵܐ 'eraqah - to flee, run
qaṭālu - ܩܛܠܐ - to kill

I personally thinks its strange espacially when we have more than 2000 loanwords. This makes me believe that these 2000 words also occurs in aramaic. I think that they share a lot of similaritys and even if a Word  sounds different i think theres always a link between aramaic and akkadian. Example the word hang. aramaic : tlå and  akkadian : taluge.  In  syriac we say both tlå and tlaqa. So if a  person asks where the root is from shall I say aramaic or akkadian ? I'm sorry but i have hard to realize that akkadian is  different  from aramaic  when it comes to the similaritys  of words but when it comes to grammatic i totally agree that it is different.

Offline Asshur

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2014, 05:12:04 PM »
Loanwords, Akkadian is a whole different language. Akkadian sounds very close to Arabic. Strange part is that Akkadian didn't Heth and didn't have 'Ayn but it has Teth and Sadhe sounds...

Here's a few examples.
English - Akkadian
Akkadian language - lišānum akkadītum
King - šarrum
Strong - dannoom
thief - šarrāq
son - mār
dog - kalab
governer - šakin
Alliances - salīmātum
land - māt-am (this is where we get the word "matha" ܡܵܬ݂ܵܐ (village) from. )
wide, open - rapšum
singular masculine "you" - atta
singular feminine "you" - atti
who? - mannu
what? - mīnū
which? - ayyu
number 1 - ištēn
2 - šinā
3 - šalāš
4 - erbē
5 - ḫamiš
6 - šediš
7 - sebē
8 - samānē
9 - tešē
10 - ešer
60 - šūš
100 - meʾat, māt
1000 - līm
erbē aššātum (four wives) (male numeral), meʾat ālānū (100 towns)

Here's some loanwords FROM Aramaic to Akkadian back to Syriac xD
erēqu - ܥܪܲܩܵܐ 'eraqah - to flee, run
qaṭālu - ܩܛܠܐ - to kill
These I just listed are actually very familar and sounds almost the same in turoyo, in Akkadian they say atta- you , in turoyo we say ''hattat - you, they also say minu while we say moniu? they say ayyu to which? we say ayna
I am Ashurbanipal, the great king, the mighty king, king of the universe, king of Assyria, king of the four quarters of the world; offspring of the loins of Esarhaddon, king of Assyria, viceroy of Babylon, king of Sumer and Akkad; grandson of Sennacherib, king of the universe, king of Assyria.

Offline Cascade

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2016, 09:13:27 AM »
Loanwords, Akkadian is a whole different language. Akkadian sounds very close to Arabic. Strange part is that Akkadian didn't Heth and didn't have 'Ayn but it has Teth and Sadhe sounds...

Here's a few examples.
English - Akkadian
Akkadian language - lišānum akkadītum
King - šarrum
Strong - dannoom
thief - šarrāq
son - mār
dog - kalab
governer - šakin
Alliances - salīmātum
land - māt-am (this is where we get the word "matha" ܡܵܬ݂ܵܐ (village) from. )
wide, open - rapšum
singular masculine "you" - atta
singular feminine "you" - atti
who? - mannu
what? - mīnū
which? - ayyu
number 1 - ištēn
2 - šinā
3 - šalāš
4 - erbē
5 - ḫamiš
6 - šediš
7 - sebē
8 - samānē
9 - tešē
10 - ešer
60 - šūš
100 - meʾat, māt
1000 - līm
erbē aššātum (four wives) (male numeral), meʾat ālānū (100 towns)

Here's some loanwords FROM Aramaic to Akkadian back to Syriac xD
erēqu - ܥܪܲܩܵܐ 'eraqah - to flee, run
qaṭālu - ܩܛܠܐ - to kill
Akkadian somehow looks Turkic, as some of these words have a vowel harmony (Sumerian even had more vowel harmony, btw).

I think you can say that Turkic languages probably evolved from Mesopotamia, perhaps diverging from Sumerian. But that's just my theory.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2016, 12:33:29 PM »
Akkadian somehow looks Turkic, as some of these words have a vowel harmony (Sumerian even had more vowel harmony, btw).

I think you can say that Turkic languages probably evolved from Mesopotamia, perhaps diverging from Sumerian. But that's just my theory.

which would be impossible considering the Zagros and Persian mountains isolated Mesopotamia from Central Asia plus the long distance from Central Asia to Mesopotamia in the age that lacked cars, trains, and airplanes :)

Offline Cascade

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Re: Difference between Akkadian and Aramaic
« Reply #11 on: December 26, 2016, 07:28:50 PM »
which would be impossible considering the Zagros and Persian mountains isolated Mesopotamia from Central Asia plus the long distance from Central Asia to Mesopotamia in the age that lacked cars, trains, and airplanes :)
I know. I'm not saying it was a quick one. Look at it a broader perspective - Humanity started in Africa. After that, we were in the Middle East (the region where writing was invented). And then we spread to Europe and the east. So it's not entirely implausible that the "mother" language family of Turkic could have probably been Afro-Asiatic (possibly one of the oldest language families in the world). After all, Indo European and Turkic languages surround us. Not sure about Turkic, but there are linguists who say that IE languages derived from Afro-Asiatic, specifically Semitic.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

 

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