Author Topic: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)  (Read 1468 times)

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Offline Cascade

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For the sake (and in respect) of Mrzurnaci, I omitted my posts critiquing the bible from his thread "A List of good arguments against Islam", since it was about the Quran and Islam. I believe a thread critiquing, and finding faults or errors in, the bible may come in handy for questioning Assyrian Christians. This thread doesn't mean to proselytize or forcefully convert people, but it gives them a perspective.

Absurd science:

*All flying insects that walk on all fours are to be detestable to you. There are, however, some winged creatures that walk on all fours that you may eat: those that have jointed legs for hopping on the ground. Of these you may eat any kind of locust, katydid, cricket or grasshopper. But all other winged creatures that have four legs you are to detest. - Leviticus 11:20-23

Insects have six legs.

*And the rock badger, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. And the hare, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. Leviticus 11:5-6

Hares and rock hyraxes DO NOT chew cud.

*There are some that only chew the cud or only have a divided hoof, but you must not eat them. The camel, though it chews the cud, does not have a divided hoof; it is ceremonially unclean for you. Leviticus 11:4

Unlike the hooves of pigs and other animals with divided hooves, the camel's in joined at the back. It is not two separate pieces, and thus not classed as a fully divided hoof.

*And these you shall detest among the birds; they shall not be eaten; they are detestable: the eagle, the bearded vulture, the black vulture, the kite, the falcon of any kind, every raven of any kind, the ostrich, the nighthawk, the sea gull, the hawk of any kind,the little owl, the cormorant, the short-eared owl, the barn owl, the tawny owl, the carrion vulture, the stork, the heron of any kind, the hoopoe, and the bat. Leviticus 11:13-19

Bats are mammals, not birds.

*Their measure is longer than the earth and broader than the sea. Job 11:9

There is no length in a sphere.  Now a flat two dimensional object would have a length.

*It is He who sits above the circle of the earth, And it's inhabitants are like grasshoppers, Who stretches out the heavens like a curtain, And spreads them out like a tent to dwell in. Isaiah 40:22

A tent would not be a good description of the earth's atmosphere nor the cosmos.  It's describing a flat floor which where there is nothing below it... no heavens below the top of the earth. 

*And God said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.” So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. God called the vault “sky.” Genesis 1:6-8

Do we really have a solid sky holding water over us?  How the heck did we get to the moon?  Does the space shuttle have a "firmament opener" on the front of it? This would explain why every time it rained in the Bible, that God had to "open the windows of heaven" (Gen. 7:1 and Isa. 24:18 are examples).

"The Lord reigns, he is clothed with majesty; The Lord is clothed, He has girded Himself with strength. Surely the world is established so that it cannot be moved." Psalms 93:1

The world does move.

*"The moon shall not cause her light to shine" Isaiah 13:10

The moon is not a source of light. Speaking of light, on the first day God created light. Except, God didn't create any sources of light until the forth day. So did he only invent the concept of  light on the first day, but no light was around until the forth day?  No matter how you look at the subject of light during the creation, it just doesn't add up. Furthermore, plants were made on the third day, before there was a sun to drive their photosynthetic processes.

*But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water. 2 Peter 3:5

The earth wasn't made out of water.

*The flowers appear on the earth; the time of the singing of birds is come, and the voice of the turtle is heard in our land. Song of Solomon 2:12

Turtles don't even make a sound.

*He will raise a banner for the nations and gather the exiles of Israel; he will assemble the scattered people of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

The earth doesn't have corners.

*Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because the Lord did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did the Lord scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth. Genesis 11:9

The world's languages evolved. They didn't appear suddenly. 


It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline Cascade

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2016, 11:52:35 PM »
Contradictions:

God good to all, or just a few?

PSA 145:9 - The LORD is good to all: and his tender mercies are over all his works.

JER 13:14 - And I will dash them one against another, even the fathers and the sons together, saith the LORD: I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy them.

War or Peace?

EXO 15:3 - The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name.

ROM 15:33 - Now the God of peace be with you all. Amen.

Is Jesus equal to or lesser than?

JOH 10:30 - I and my Father are one.

JOH 14:28 - Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

The sins of the father

ISA 14:21 - Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.

DEU 24:16 - The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

Moses' personality

NUM 12:3 - "Now the man Moses was very meek, above all the men which were upon the face of the earth."

NUM 31:14, 17, 18 - "And Moses was wroth...And Moses said unto them, "Have ye saved all the women alive? ... Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman, ... But all the women children ... keep alive for yourselves."

Righteous live?

PSA 92:12 - "The righteous shall flourish like the palm tree."

ISA 57:1 - "The righteous perisheth, and no man layeth it to heart."

God CAN be seen:

"And I will take away my hand, and thou shalt see my backparts." (EXO 33:23)
"And the Lord spake to Moses face to face, as a man speaketh to his friend." (EXO 33:11)
"For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved." (GEN 32:30)

God CANNOT be seen:

"No man hath seen God at any time." (JOH 1:18)
"And he said, Thou canst not see my face; for there shall no man see me and live." (EXO 33:20)
"Whom no man hath seen nor can see." (1TIM 6:16)

CRUEL, UNMERCIFUL, DESTRUCTIVE, and FEROCIOUS or KIND, MERCIFUL, and GOOD:

"I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy." (JER 13:14) "Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not, but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling."

"The Lord is very pitiful and of tender mercy." (JAS 5:11)
"For his mercy endureth forever." (1CH 16:34)
"The Lord is good to all, and his tender mercies are over all his works." (PSA 145:9)
"God is love." (1JO 4:16)

Ascension to heaven:

"And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." (2KI 2:11)

"No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, ... the Son of Man." (JOH 3:13)

Jesus and God are one, or not...?

Matthew 24:36 - No one knows about that day or hour, not even the Son, but the Father only.
(Here Jesus makes a distinction between what he knows and what the Father knows.)

Matthew 26:39 - My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me, yet not as I will, but as Thou will.
(Jesus’ will is likewise autonomous from God’s Will. Jesus is seeking acquiescence to God’s will.)

John 5:26 - For as the Father has life in Himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself.
(Jesus received his life from God. God received his life from no one. He is eternally self-existent.)

John 5:19 - The Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees the Father doing, because whatever the Father does, the Son does also.
(Jesus declares that he is following a pattern laid down by God. He is expressing obedience to God.)

Mark 10:18 - Why do you call me good? No one is good, except God alone.
(Here Jesus emphatically makes a distinction between himself and God.)

John 14:28 - The Father is greater than I.
(This is another strong statement that makes a distinction between Jesus and God.)

Matthew 27:46 - My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?
(Inconceivable if he is God the Creator.)

It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2016, 10:10:32 PM »
don't forget that Christianity saved your identity and people from entirely disappearing.

Offline Assyrian Nationalist

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #3 on: September 25, 2016, 10:52:14 PM »
don't forget that Christianity saved your identity and people from entirely disappearing.

I really wish people like you could stop saying that..

Offline Cascade

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2016, 04:27:29 AM »
don't forget that Christianity saved your identity and people from entirely disappearing.
So according to your logic, because myths "saved" our identity we should automatically be believers, or apologists? And nobody's out to kill Christians. We just lack faith in its ideology. Say that to those who kill and persecute Christians.

1. The support of our Church and the togetherness of our people saved us. NOT some book, especially the Judaic Torah, which has nothing to do with the Assyrian Nestorian doctrine.

2. This thread didn't even bash any biblical figure. It just questioned their authenticity and mostly the contradictory writing. There are posts in the internet that say "Jesus is evil","Christians are scum", etc, now what would you say of such folks?

3. If you want to contribute to this thread, add quotes from the Torah at least (if you find that "bashing" the NT is a touchy issue for you). Not sure why you're finding excuses to justify the myths of the bible when you're not a believer? :blink:
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline ASHOOR

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2016, 09:40:13 AM »
Neon, I have actually heard people address these supposed contradictions and why they are not what you think they are, even when it is so plain and clear. Having said that.

Also, some of these are very obvious and no need arguing about. For example, you brought up this one "All flying insects that walk on all fours "

Whether it was back then or now, it was probably obvious to most, that insects have 6 rather than 4 legs. Fine. The point here is that the person who came up with that quote in the bible is not trying to prove something scientific. In other words, think about the context he said it in. Still doesn't change the fact that it is probably wrong, but that is not the point.

There are many other ones which you posted, that I won't go into, that are easy to see are not contradictions, but all about context. It is easy to take a book that has thousands and thousands of pages, written across 2 millennia, by hundreds of authors, to try and find mistakes and contradictions. But if you dig a little deeper, you will realize it is probably not what it appears on the surface.

There is a reason this book has stood the test of time, it is not a coincidence.

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Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2016, 11:50:36 AM »
So according to your logic, because myths "saved" our identity we should automatically be believers, or apologists? And nobody's out to kill Christians. We just lack faith in its ideology. Say that to those who kill and persecute Christians.

1. The support of our Church and the togetherness of our people saved us. NOT some book, especially the Judaic Torah, which has nothing to do with the Assyrian Nestorian doctrine.

2. This thread didn't even bash any biblical figure. It just questioned their authenticity and mostly the contradictory writing. There are posts in the internet that say "Jesus is evil","Christians are scum", etc, now what would you say of such folks?

3. If you want to contribute to this thread, add quotes from the Torah at least (if you find that "bashing" the NT is a touchy issue for you). Not sure why you're finding excuses to justify the myths of the bible when you're not a believer? :blink:

No, the point is that we "owe" it... We could've Muslims and me and you would either be fighting ISIS or fighting as ISIS... (Shi'a or Sunni basically).
And given our case of living in the Ottoman empire, we would've likely been Sunni Muslims.
Secondly, I highly doubt we would've held on to Aramaic, our Mesopotamian culture and ideas, and our identity...

Notice how there's an extremely few amount of Muslims that speak Western Aramaic in Ma'aloula. Similar to the extremely few amount of Muslims that speak Syriac (Mhallamis) and they don't even consider themselves Assyrian.

Offline Cascade

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2016, 11:58:32 AM »
Neon, I have actually heard people address these supposed contradictions and why they are not what you think they are, even when it is so plain and clear. Having said that.

Also, some of these are very obvious and no need arguing about. For example, you brought up this one "All flying insects that walk on all fours "

Whether it was back then or now, it was probably obvious to most, that insects have 6 rather than 4 legs. Fine. The point here is that the person who came up with that quote in the bible is not trying to prove something scientific. In other words, think about the context he said it in. Still doesn't change the fact that it is probably wrong, but that is not the point.

There are many other ones which you posted, that I won't go into, that are easy to see are not contradictions, but all about context. It is easy to take a book that has thousands and thousands of pages, written across 2 millennia, by hundreds of authors, to try and find mistakes and contradictions. But if you dig a little deeper, you will realize it is probably not what it appears on the surface.

There is a reason this book has stood the test of time, it is not a coincidence.

ASHOOR
I see and understand your point about the contradiction thing.

Glad we agree about the insects' legs. Perhaps Moses was naively ignorant about their anatomy (he was the "person" who wrote it, btw). But doesn't this kinda prove that he probably didn't have divine intervention when he wrote the Torah? If God is all-knowing, wouldn't he have told him how many legs insects have and if camels chew the cud or not? Or a simpler solution, he could've just plainly look at a few insects and see how many legs they have.  :mrgreen:

To be fair, there are verses in the bible that do have a sound scientific accuracy:

*The universe having countless of stars. Back then people generally thought the earth had a few thousand stars.
*Earth floats in space, when so many beliefs back then stated that we sat on an animal.
*Each star is different from another, when most people back then thought all stars were alike.
*Oceans have deep valleys and mountains. Back then most people thought that the ocean floor was flat.
*The bible does explicitly say the earth is a circle or sphere, but in one verse they "ruin" that concept by comparing the earth to a tent being stretched out.
*Now this one is more inadvertent or incidental, but hell is to be said to be underneath us, when there actually is a fiery place beneath the earth (inner core).

With that being said, the scientific (and even historical) inaccuracies still surpass these decent verses.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline Cascade

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2016, 12:26:42 PM »
No, the point is that we "owe" it... We could've Muslims and me and you would either be fighting ISIS or fighting as ISIS... (Shi'a or Sunni basically).
And given our case of living in the Ottoman empire, we would've likely been Sunni Muslims.
Secondly, I highly doubt we would've held on to Aramaic, our Mesopotamian culture and ideas, and our identity...

Notice how there's an extremely few amount of Muslims that speak Western Aramaic in Ma'aloula. Similar to the extremely few amount of Muslims that speak Syriac (Mhallamis) and they don't even consider themselves Assyrian.
False equivalence at its greatest. Now this is a logical fallacy (and I thought you're expert on those). I mean, I'm trying to make an argument about how a 2000 year old book is mythical (to help questioning Assyrians who linger here) and yet you're talking of Islam, Assyrian identity, Mhallamis... What does that have to do with anything? Yes, Christianity may have played a role helping us not cower to Islam. Now does it mean that the events in the bible are all of a sudden fact? As a skeptic yourself the answer should be no, really. 

To put it bluntly, no, we don't "owe" to myths. I can't believe that I'm saying this to a deist/skeptic. Just admit that you're a Christian and trust me, I won't say anything back to you, because I'll understand your position. It's just astonishing that this is coming from a supposed non-believer, hence my elaborate replies. Seriously, are you doing this to please your fellow Assyrian Christians in here ("hey look at me, I still think like you, so don't discredit me") or do you really have these warped apologetic views?

Your logic: "Moses parting the Red Sea, the earth flooding, Elijah flying to heaven and Jesus's resurrection must be true stories because Christianity played a role at saving our people". And yet,  that's coming from an unbeliever? :/
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2016, 03:19:21 PM »
False equivalence at its greatest. Now this is a logical fallacy (and I thought you're expert on those). I mean, I'm trying to make an argument about how a 2000 year old book is mythical (to help questioning Assyrians who linger here) and yet you're talking of Islam, Assyrian identity, Mhallamis... What does that have to do with anything? Yes, Christianity may have played a role helping us not cower to Islam. Now does it mean that the events in the bible are all of a sudden fact? As a skeptic yourself the answer should be no, really. 

To put it bluntly, no, we don't "owe" to myths. I can't believe that I'm saying this to a deist/skeptic. Just admit that you're a Christian and trust me, I won't say anything back to you, because I'll understand your position. It's just astonishing that this is coming from a supposed non-believer, hence my elaborate replies. Seriously, are you doing this to please your fellow Assyrian Christians in here ("hey look at me, I still think like you, so don't discredit me") or do you really have these warped apologetic views?

Your logic: "Moses parting the Red Sea, the earth flooding, Elijah flying to heaven and Jesus's resurrection must be true stories because Christianity played a role at saving our people". And yet,  that's coming from an unbeliever? :/

How is that a false equivalence? It's not false equivalence but an emotional plea.

Secondly, why are you trying to make it seem like Christianity is holding us back? During our early Christian period, we were the top scientists, logicians, and doctors in the world (at that time) with some of the best schools.

I'm not a Christian. I'm simply aware of what Christianity has given us and I can explain it to you but it's an extremely long explanation but I can still tell you if you want.

Are you so blind that you cannot see what kind of religion Christianity truly is? If you want to explain it all, just reply that you want me to explain.

Offline Cascade

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2016, 11:14:02 AM »
How is that a false equivalence? It's not false equivalence but an emotional plea.
You brought up our history, which has nothing to do with the bible being fact or not. Or the point of this thread.

Quote
Secondly, why are you trying to make it seem like Christianity is holding us back? During our early Christian period, we were the top scientists, logicians, and doctors in the world (at that time) with some of the best schools.
Nobody's saying that Christianity's held us back. And we weren't top scientists or logicians because of our religion. Even if we were, that doesn't mean the events in the bible weren't a myth.

Quote
I'm not a Christian. I'm simply aware of what Christianity has given us and I can explain it to you but it's an extremely long explanation but I can still tell you if you want.
Well, you sound like a Christian. And that isn't a bad thing. You can always be honest. Again, Christianity may have been advantageous for us to some extent, but why should we "believe" in it? Why is this so hard to grasp for a non-Christian like yourself?

Dial-up was very efficient for us in the 80s and 90s. It made us came all this way. It revolutionized the usage of internet. Doesn't mean that we should be using it now. And this isn't a false equivalence, it's a decent analogy.

Quote
Are you so blind that you cannot see what kind of religion Christianity truly is? If you want to explain it all, just reply that you want me to explain.
An unbeliever defensively calling me blind because I oppose his ex-religion's myths and fables? You're making a satire of yourself, man. Really.

Jesus is the central figure of Christianity. He has taught peace and love. He was ultimately executed. However, he was never "resurrected". He didn't do any miracles and the likes. I'm sure you agree with this? Okay, so what's the problem? Because I take this a "step further" where I want people to open their eyes and realize that this was just a fictional tale? Is that what you don't like? You seem to have an irrational reaction (considering that you don't believe yourself) when people say the bible is fiction. You can tell, judging from your reaction in this thread. So, explain that?
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #11 on: September 27, 2016, 12:04:08 PM »
You brought up our history, which has nothing to do with the bible being fact or not. Or the point of this thread.
Nobody's saying that Christianity's held us back. And we weren't top scientists or logicians because of our religion. Even if we were, that doesn't mean the events in the bible weren't a myth.
Well, you sound like a Christian. And that isn't a bad thing. You can always be honest. Again, Christianity may have been advantageous for us to some extent, but why should we "believe" in it? Why is this so hard to grasp for a non-Christian like yourself?

Dial-up was very efficient for us in the 80s and 90s. It made us came all this way. It revolutionized the usage of internet. Doesn't mean that we should be using it now. And this isn't a false equivalence, it's a decent analogy.
An unbeliever defensively calling me blind because I oppose his ex-religion's myths and fables? You're making a satire of yourself, man. Really.

Jesus is the central figure of Christianity. He has taught peace and love. He was ultimately executed. However, he was never "resurrected". He didn't do any miracles and the likes. I'm sure you agree with this? Okay, so what's the problem? Because I take this a "step further" where I want people to open their eyes and realize that this was just a fictional tale? Is that what you don't like? You seem to have an irrational reaction (considering that you don't believe yourself) when people say the bible is fiction. You can tell, judging from your reaction in this thread. So, explain that?

ok, you're dense so I might as well explain it...

It's not about Christianity's myths and fables, it's about ITS IDEOLOGY khmaree...

Judaism, Christianity, and Islam are all religions but they're mostly Ideologies wrapped around a supernatural idea.

Religion is a subset of ideas which is why the USA's Constitution allows Freedom of Religion, because it ties directly with Freedom of Thought...

Christianity's ideology, as spread by its myths and fables, is what saved us from assimilation and extinction.

You're so fixated on the fables and myths that you cannot see what the religion is beyond them...

Think about the ideology behind Judaism and how it drives them to succeed. Judaism is the reason why Jews aren't assimilated or extinct either, it's the same thing for us...

Offline Cascade

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2016, 06:58:55 AM »
ok, you're dense so I might as well explain it...

It's not about Christianity's myths and fables, it's about ITS IDEOLOGY khmaree...

Judaism, Christianity, and Islam are all religions but they're mostly Ideologies wrapped around a supernatural idea.

Religion is a subset of ideas which is why the USA's Constitution allows Freedom of Religion, because it ties directly with Freedom of Thought...

Christianity's ideology, as spread by its myths and fables, is what saved us from assimilation and extinction.

You're so fixated on the fables and myths that you cannot see what the religion is beyond them...

Think about the ideology behind Judaism and how it drives them to succeed. Judaism is the reason why Jews aren't assimilated or extinct either, it's the same thing for us...
You're proving to me more and more that you're the Cenk Uygur of Christianity. A blatant, hypocritical apologist. For the umpteenth time, just because Christianity "saved" us doesn't mean we should adhere to it in this day and age. And nobody's forcing them to convert. Read the opening post, this thread is only giving you a perspective. But you're too butthurt and emotional to see that, so you act defensive ("don't diss my religion okay?"). Tell me, Cenk, you're gonna teach your children about the Christian idea of hell fire and how they'd burn for all eternity, just because that religion saved your ancestors?

If people defend Islam and its myths you should be consistent & not refute it, because you're also an apologetic sympathizer and a hypocrite as they are. I mean, you see the absurdities in the Quran, but then you conveniently don't see them in your own holy book (Lol). Let's face it, you are still heavily inclined towards your native religion. It's so obvious, since you can't even make decent arguments up there ("we were saved by Christianity, so we can't let it go").

Admit it, you're doing this to please your fellow Assyrian believers, so they won't discredit you. You're still their puppet, or what we Assyrians/Arabs call "looty". You're still in the brainwashed and confused state. Go make up your own mind already and quit being in limbo mindset. But since you're such a fan of your ideology, I'd encourage you to remain a Christian. Helps save time, so I won't have to argue with you.

P.S. Enough about "Christianity saving our people". You don't know the alternative side of our history. Nobody does. Maybe we would've remained pagan. Maybe we would've been Zoroastrian. Or Jews for that matter. You don't know.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2016, 07:18:46 PM »
You're proving to me more and more that you're the Cenk Uygur of Christianity. A blatant, hypocritical apologist. For the umpteenth time, just because Christianity "saved" us doesn't mean we should adhere to it in this day and age. And nobody's forcing them to convert. Read the opening post, this thread is only giving you a perspective. But you're too butthurt and emotional to see that, so you act defensive ("don't diss my religion okay?"). Tell me, Cenk, you're gonna teach your children about the Christian idea of hell fire and how they'd burn for all eternity, just because that religion saved your ancestors?

If people defend Islam and its myths you should be consistent & not refute it, because you're also an apologetic sympathizer and a hypocrite as they are. I mean, you see the absurdities in the Quran, but then you conveniently don't see them in your own holy book (Lol). Let's face it, you are still heavily inclined towards your native religion. It's so obvious, since you can't even make decent arguments up there ("we were saved by Christianity, so we can't let it go").

Admit it, you're doing this to please your fellow Assyrian believers, so they won't discredit you. You're still their puppet, or what we Assyrians/Arabs call "looty". You're still in the brainwashed and confused state. Go make up your own mind already and quit being in limbo mindset. But since you're such a fan of your ideology, I'd encourage you to remain a Christian. Helps save time, so I won't have to argue with you.

P.S. Enough about "Christianity saving our people". You don't know the alternative side of our history. Nobody does. Maybe we would've remained pagan. Maybe we would've been Zoroastrian. Or Jews for that matter. You don't know.

Whatever, this is your thread and you're free to do and think as you want but at least THINK about what I've said?

Offline Cascade

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2016, 07:54:20 AM »
Whatever, this is your thread and you're free to do and think as you want but at least THINK about what I've said?
Well, you derailed it and made a straw man. Nobody's saying that Christianity didn't do anything for us (what you thought I suggested). But can Assyrians nowadays freely ditch it? Why not. Let's say that the religion solely made survive back then, but what's the use of it today? I survived on milk as a baby. Now I could hardly stand its smell, let alone taste it, and I'm living fine. The past is the past, we can't always cling on it. You can also think about what I said, no?

P.S. Now add verses already and quit being a looty.  :frustrated:
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: List of contradictions and absurdities in the bible (Judaeo-Christianity)
« Reply #15 on: September 29, 2016, 09:02:25 PM »
Well, you derailed it and made a straw man. Nobody's saying that Christianity didn't do anything for us (what you thought I suggested). But can Assyrians nowadays freely ditch it? Why not. Let's say that the religion solely made survive back then, but what's the use of it today? I survived on milk as a baby. Now I could hardly stand its smell, let alone taste it, and I'm living fine. The past is the past, we can't always cling on it. You can also think about what I said, no?

P.S. Now add verses already and quit being a looty.  :frustrated:

Even better, a new religion JUST for us!

Offline Cascade

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Here are a few verses in the bible that condemns everyday things that nearly all of us are "guilty" of doing:

No shellfish, clams, oysters, urchins, or lobsters:
Leviticus 11:10 - “And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you.”

No ripped jeans:
Leviticus 10:6 - “Uncover not your heads, neither rend your clothes; lest ye die, and lest wrath come upon all the people.”

You also can't wear mixed clothes:
Leviticus 19:19 - “Neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee.”

No short haircuts:
Leviticus 19:27 - “Ye shall not round the corners of your heads.”

Beard required:
Leviticus 19:27 - “Neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.”

No tattoos (sorry, Assyrian hunks):
Leviticus 19:28 - “Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the Lord.”

No gossiping:
Leviticus 19:16 - “Thou shalt not go up and down as a talebearer among thy people: neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy neighbor; I am the LORD.”

Do not mix animal breeds (sorry, pet lovers):
Leviticus 19:19 - “Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind.”

Don't touch dead animals:
Leviticus 5:2 - “If a soul touch any unclean thing, whether it be a carcase of an unclean beast, or a carcase of unclean cattle, or the carcase of unclean creeping things, and if it be hidden from him; he also shall be unclean, and guilty.”

Women on her periods can't go to mass:
Leviticus 12:4–5 - “And she shall then continue in the blood of her purifying three and thirty days; she shall touch no hallowed thing, nor come into the sanctuary, until the days of her purifying be fulfilled. But if she bear a maid child, then she shall be unclean two weeks, as in her separation: and she shall continue in the blood of her purifying threescore and six days.”

No alcohol in church:
Leviticus 10:9 - “Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die.”

No manual labor on Saturdays:
Exodus 31:14–15 - “Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.”

Leviticus 23:3 - “Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the Sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.”

No going to church after birth:
Leviticus 12:2 - "Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean."

No round haircuts:
Leviticus 19:27 - “You shall not round off the side-growth of your heads.”

No testicles, no heaven:
Deuteronomy 23:1 - "A man whose testicles are crushed or whose penis is cut off may never join the assembly of the Lord."

The disabled and deformed not permitted in mass:
Leviticus 21:17 - “Say to Aaron; ‘For the generations to come none of your descendants who has a defect may come near to offer the food of his God. No man who has any defect may come near: no man who is blind or lame, disfigured or deformed; nor his nose or eyes be flat."

No food with high fat content (looking at you, cheeseburgers):
Leviticus 3:17 - “It shall be a perpetual statute for your generations throughout all your dwellings, that ye eat neither fat nor blood.”

Getting married after a divorce (sorry, my Assyrian friend Zaia):
Mark 10:11–12 - “Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.”

No jewelry (Assyrians weddings must be satanic):
Timothy 2:9 - “Likewise, I want women to adorn themselves with proper clothing, modestly and discreetly, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly garments."

No divorce:
1 Corinthians 7:10–11 - “To the married I give this charge (not I, but the Lord): the wife should not separate from her husband (but if she does, she should remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband), and the husband should not divorce his wife.”

Women should be covered or bald:
1 Corinthians 11:6 - "For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered."

Women must be silent in church (sorry, Assyrian gossipers):
1 Corinthians 14:34 - “Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law."

Checking women out (god knows how guilty Assyrians men are here):
Matthew 5:28 - “But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.”

But who cares about the the above laws, right? Obviously these two matter the most:
Leviticus 20:13 - “If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads."

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 - "Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."
« Last Edit: August 09, 2017, 11:09:47 PM by Cascade »
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline shekwanta

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Ouffffff.. This is one of the topics I would REALLY REALLY wanna discuss, but you know what..naaah.. I'm just gonna let go.
I don't have the nerves to go into deep discussions and get myself angry and emotional. Especially not in subjects where I know FOR SURE that I wouldn't change my mind no matter what I'm told.
No offense you guys :)



P.S. Mrzurnaci I'm kinda shocked you're not Christian. I always thought you were! ..

Offline Cascade

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Ouffffff.. This is one of the topics I would REALLY REALLY wanna discuss, but you know what..naaah.. I'm just gonna let go.
I don't have the nerves to go into deep discussions and get myself angry and emotional. Especially not in subjects where I know FOR SURE that I wouldn't change my mind no matter what I'm told.
No offense you guys :)



P.S. Mrzurnaci I'm kinda shocked you're not Christian. I always thought you were! ..
I just quoted the biblical verses. I didn't even say what was on my mind or what my opinion was. Everything you saw listed up there was the bible speaking. So are you going to be angry and emotional with your own bible? :p

P.S. He's a cultural Christian. Probably still believes in a few biblical contents. You can say he's "half Christian". Lol.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline Crocodile Bani

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Most of the quotes above are from the old testament which as far as I am concerned, if you believe in Jesus and are a Christian, are completely irrelevant to you.  Never understood the term Judeo-Christian because they are completely different faiths.

Having said this, there are a small number of the above quotes which are from the New Testament.  I think Ashoor hit the nail on the head, in that we need to read the line in context and not be a Jehovah's Witness and isolate the sentence and make it mean whatever we want it to mean. 

The issue regarding the number of legs an insect has.  Whilst context is the key to understanding, if a book is "divine", it shouldn't contain such errors.  The Old testament contains several historical errors (For example, the son of Hammurabi who had the Judeans captive has a completely different name in the Old testament than in any other historical source).

Whilst I am more Christian than Agnostic/atheist, there are contradictions in my beliefs because of my lack of belief in the Old Testament which contains so many historical errors that a divine book should not contain.  The contradiction in my beliefs comes in the New testament constantly referring to the Old testament.  The book that I believe in, which makes sense as a stand alone book, refers to a book which I don't believe in due to the inaccuracies. 

Another thing you need to take into account with the Old Testament is who wrote it, why it was written and where it was written.  The Judeans and Levites who were captive by the Babylonians wrote it.  They did it to preserve Judean history, as they were held captive and restricted from passing on their culture to their offspring.  Torah simple means "The Law".  Therefore many of the rules in Levictus which sound absurd are merely the laws that the law makers had at the time.  Back then, religious leaders and politicians were pretty much the same thing.  There was no difference.  In fact, religion was not even a concept.  Law makers were law makers.  The Torah was NOT written to start a new religion.  Religion was not even a concept back then.  It was only when it was translated to Greek for the benefit of Judeans who could not speak Hebrew that people outside the Judeans and Babylonians were introduced to the concept of God. 
Back in Darwin for the 2nd time in my life.  Originally from Sydney (Fairfield area), lived in Vanuatu, Japan (twice), Thailand and Darwin once previously.  Western Sydney Wanderers fan as well as Parramatta Eels.  Veteran of 3 World Cups (*1994, 2006 and 2010).

Offline Cascade

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Most of the quotes above are from the old testament which as far as I am concerned, if you believe in Jesus and are a Christian, are completely irrelevant to you.  Never understood the term Judeo-Christian because they are completely different faiths.
The New Testament contradicts itself on whether Christians should believe in the Old Testament or not.

Jesus has said, ‘The Scripture cannot be broken’ (John 10:35). He referred to Scripture as ‘the commandment of God’ (Matthew 15:3) and as the ‘Word of God’ (Mark 7:13). He also indicated that it was indestructible: ‘Until Heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass away from the law, until all is accomplished’ (Matthew 5:18).

On the other hand, Paul declares the old testament as being outdated, ‘By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear’ (Hebrews 8:13). So, whose words do you prefer, Jesus's or Paul's?

I use Judaeo-Christian when I'm talking about the bible as a whole. The Old Testament is not purely Christian, even though Christians may abide to it.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline shekwanta

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I just quoted the biblical verses. I didn't even say what was on my mind or what my opinion was. Everything you saw listed up there was the bible speaking. So are you going to be angry and emotional with your own bible? :p

P.S. He's a cultural Christian. Probably still believes in a few biblical contents. You can say he's "half Christian". Lol.
I don't think you got me right. In case you didn't, what I meant was actually that I'm a very religious Christian. I would never get angry/emotional with "my own bible". If anything, I would get angry/emotional with everyone and anything else beside that! ;)

And taking verses from the bible and placing them here doesn't prove anything btw. We all know what the bible SAYS, but fewer people know what it MEANS. Instead of searching only after verses, how about you look for their meanings; I'm sure you'll find them just by looking the same way you did earlier.

I would be more open to discussion and explanation, but like I said, I get too involved in religious topics, so I'm gonna let this one go. :)

Offline Cascade

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I don't think you got me right. In case you didn't, what I meant was actually that I'm a very religious Christian. I would never get angry/emotional with "my own bible". If anything, I would get angry/emotional with everyone and anything else beside that! ;)

And taking verses from the bible and placing them here doesn't prove anything btw. We all know what the bible SAYS, but fewer people know what it MEANS. Instead of searching only after verses, how about you look for their meanings; I'm sure you'll find them just by looking the same way you did earlier.

I would be more open to discussion and explanation, but like I said, I get too involved in religious topics, so I'm gonna let this one go. :)
Not all biblical verses are figurative or metaphorical. ;)

For instance, Jesus saying "peace but a sword" meant division, not violence. Same thing with "pluck your eye out if it causes you to sin". He didn't mean it literally. Most of Jesus's words were parables.

However, the Old Testament or the Torah were literal and straightforward. Yes, so no jewelry, no tattoos and insects have four legs.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

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