Author Topic: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!  (Read 3391 times)

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Offline Sharukinu

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I've just uploaded a video that I made that has a fairly comprehensive lesson on the narrow but crucial starting point of linking-verbs and pronouns. Please check it out and share your opinions, affirmations and (more importantly) your criticisms:



I'm not adept in Modern Assyrian but I'll teach everything I know since barely anyone is doing something like that on YouTube, let alone being as concise. Although I'm resolutely in favour of completely reconstructing our language, we need to maintain momentum by continuing to teach Assyrian Neo-Aramaic as we know it. I'd like anyone who's interested in working on this to message me so that we can develop our ideas further, develop this into a lasting series, propagate our language and educate our youth as much as possible.

You do NOT have to be an expert. Being passionate and capable of critical thinking are the main requirements :) Please contact me without hesitation.

Kind regards,


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Offline Googoo

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2016, 07:39:29 AM »
Wonderful, it helped me learn some basics. Are you just willing to teach Spoken Assyrian or written as well? I think once you reach a point where you believe your audience can construct a sentence say, lesson 15 then you should add exercises in between so rather than telling us how it goes, test us and then tell us - so we get to think for ourselves.  I'm sure many users will be delighted to help you with this namely, mrzurnaci and Carlo since they're both very passionate about teaching/learning the Assyrian language.  :)


Good luck! P.S: Your accent is so nice.  :)

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2016, 08:00:34 AM »
Thanks for your feedback! :) I don't know written Assyrian well enough to teach it. Your right in that I should incorporate homework/assignments/tests between my uploads but all of this is going to need a lot of work, proofreading and time which brings us back to the point about getting a team started.

I literally laughed at my own voice after watching the video because I didn't think I sounded like that...then again, I don't cut my own hair.
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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2016, 08:00:34 AM »

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2016, 10:57:59 AM »
>not professional at Neo-Aramaic
>tries to teach Neo-Aramaic...

Fair enough, did you at least use my Syriac diagram chart to teach the alphabet in a more concise manner?

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2016, 12:53:40 PM »
>not professional at Neo-Aramaic
>tries to teach Neo-Aramaic...

Fair enough, did you at least use my Syriac diagram chart to teach the alphabet in a more concise manner?
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you didn't finish reading what I wrote. So I'll recapitulate and expand upon the rationale behind it. This is the way I see it: if my knowledge here is greater than yours, you ought to learn from my video; if my knowledge is less than yours, you should have volunteered to work with me and/or delivered constructive criticism (as was my evident primary intention for this thread) as apposed to shrugging me off. If you think that both you and I have too little knowledge, then you clearly think this material is not needed, presumably due to a misconception that there is abundant material out there in this format (well, there isn't).

The title of the video says "exclusive of alphabet" which is consistent with it's omission of the Alepbeet. Yes, you'd be right to say people need to learn the Alepbeet but, I felt like skipping that part for my first video at least -considering there are way too many Alepbeet videos out there. And yes, your Syriac chart is nice.

The original post was a plea for Assyrians to contribute to this project. The video was a remedy to the disparity between our knowledge as a collective community and the accessibility of that information. Currently, this absence of information is appalling and very embarrassing and quite frankly, you strike me as a bizarre Assyrian for implicitly disqualifying me from trying to reconcile that disparity without you then offering a viable solution or a reason for me to drop the matter. Was the video crap or does this kind of stuff already exist on YouTube? In any case, I don't see the reasoning behind me not making these videos if my goal is to form a team (of an unpredictable but highly likely, far better capability than myself alone) to produce more material in the future.

I'd hate to get off on the wrong foot. Especially here of all places. Thanks for your support.
If anyone is still interested, please contact me!

Regards,
« Last Edit: March 09, 2016, 01:05:43 PM by Sharukinu »
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Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2016, 01:15:55 PM »
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you didn't finish reading what I wrote. So I'll recapitulate and expand upon the rationale behind it. This is the way I see it: if my knowledge here is greater than yours, you ought to learn from my video; if my knowledge is less than yours, you should have volunteered to work with me and/or delivered constructive criticism (as was my evident primary intention for this thread) as apposed to shrugging me off. If you think that both you and I have too little knowledge, then you clearly think this material is not needed, presumably due to a misconception that there is abundant material out there in this format (well, there isn't).

The title of the video says "exclusive of alphabet" which is consistent with it's omission of the Alepbeet. Yes, you'd be right to say people need to learn the Alepbeet but, I felt like skipping that part for my first video at least -considering there are way too many Alepbeet videos out there. And yes, your Syriac chart is nice.

The original post was a plea for Assyrians to contribute to this project. The video was a remedy to the disparity between our knowledge as a collective community and the accessibility of that information. Currently, this absence of information is appalling and very embarrassing and quite frankly, you strike me as a bizarre Assyrian for implicitly disqualifying me from trying to reconcile that disparity without you then offering a viable solution or a reason for me to drop the matter. Was the video crap or does this kind of stuff already exist on YouTube? In any case, I don't see the reasoning behind me not making these videos if my goal is to form a team (of an unpredictable but highly likely, far better capability than myself alone) to produce more material in the future.

I'd hate to get off on the wrong foot. Especially here of all places. Thanks for your support.
If anyone is still interested, please contact me!

Regards,

lingual understanding is actually more important than literacy (what good is the alphabet is nobody knows the language?)

But anyone who understands Syriac beyond the basic level should definitely learn to read and write Syriac.

Have you done a video (series) that cover basic Eastern Syriac grammar both basic and advanced?

If you haven't, do a basic video (series) then cover advanced.

Offline Cascade

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2016, 09:37:18 PM »
Nice to see an Assyrian-Australian in here. They're so few on AVN. Overall, a nice articulate tutorial. Are you from Sydney or Melb btw? :)

Just a little elucidation, I wouldn't say that the "a" in "ana" is the same as in "father". The vowel in "ana" resembles a more shorter A (think of how Brits pronounce "sandy"). "Father" has a long, broad A sound in general - I don't hear Assyrians using that long vowel for "ana" (i.e. "ah-nah"), unless if they're those thick accented Tyari's?  :mrgreen:

Maybe I'm nitpicking up there. But again, an awesome tutorial.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2016, 09:53:43 PM by Neon »
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Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2016, 01:25:48 AM »
Nice to see an Assyrian-Australian in here. They're so few on AVN. Overall, a nice articulate tutorial. Are you from Sydney or Melb btw? :)

Just a little elucidation, I wouldn't say that the "a" in "ana" is the same as in "father". The vowel in "ana" resembles a more shorter A (think of how Brits pronounce "sandy"). "Father" has a long, broad A sound in general - I don't hear Assyrians using that long vowel for "ana" (i.e. "ah-nah"), unless if they're those thick accented Tyari's?  :mrgreen:

Maybe I'm nitpicking up there. But again, an awesome tutorial.

Thanks for your feedback! :) From what I've heard, the majority of Assyrians pronounce the first vowel in all two-syllable pronouns with that deep 'A' sound, always placing emphasis on the first syllable of those pronouns.  Those two-syllable pronouns are also written in Assyrian using a 'zqapa' atop the first alep. The zqapa is longest/deepest 'a' we have. Perhaps I've ironically obfuscated how it's normally pronounced by dragging out the sounds. But naturally, I sound to others like I'm intentionally doing that, and people will correct it by uttering it faster as in everyday speech. The main point is not exactly the duration, rather it is not to say some short-breathed 'a'. The next closest option is the short 'a' sound as in axnoxun. Surely that 'a' is far closer to the typical British pronunciation of Sandy? Btw, I didn't mention in the video that the 'a' in "aat" (one syllable) can be like the longer/deeper 'a' in father, or it can be like the 'u' in umbrella though the latter sounds a little unrefined to me.

I know there is widespread variation but the way is see it: Aana is usually pronounced with emphasis on the first syllable which I hear as 'aa'-na as apposed to aan-na or an-na or a-na. The last two sound more like Arabic. I do hear Assyrians sometimes say aan-na or uhn-na but it doesn't sound like the norm (nor can I find a dictionary entry that reflects that pronunciation) Who knows, maybe I'm deaf and were talking cheese and chalk? LOL :)
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Offline Cascade

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2016, 02:18:10 AM »
Thanks for your feedback! :) From what I've heard, the majority of Assyrians pronounce the first vowel in all two-syllable pronouns with that deep 'A' sound, always placing emphasis on the first syllable of those pronouns.  Those two-syllable pronouns are also written in Assyrian using a 'zqapa' atop the first alep. The zqapa is longest/deepest 'a' we have. Perhaps I've ironically obfuscated how it's normally pronounced by dragging out the sounds. But naturally, I sound to others like I'm intentionally doing that, and people will correct it by uttering it faster as in everyday speech. The main point is not exactly the duration, rather it is not to say some short-breathed 'a'. The next closest option is the short 'a' sound as in axnoxun. Surely that 'a' is far closer to the typical British pronunciation of Sandy? Btw, I didn't mention in the video that the 'a' in "aat" (one syllable) can be like the longer/deeper 'a' in father, or it can be like the 'u' in umbrella though the latter sounds a little unrefined to me.

I know there is widespread variation but the way is see it: Aana is usually pronounced with emphasis on the first syllable which I hear as 'aa'-na as apposed to aan-na or an-na or a-na. The last two sound more like Arabic. I do hear Assyrians sometimes say aan-na or uhn-na but it doesn't sound like the norm (nor can I find a dictionary entry that reflects that pronunciation) Who knows, maybe I'm deaf and were talking cheese and chalk? LOL :)
I think it will be better if this were an audible chat. I can't be so precise on a keyboard.  :) 

Yes, the "a" is more slower (or longer) in Arabic's "anna" (which sounds like "ena" to my ears). Yes, we do say it more like "ah-nah". But that "ah" sounds like an unrounded vowel rather. It's kinda of a "short a" sound that is still longer than the "a" in cat, if that makes sense? To be specific, it's not exactly the broad A (as ubiquitously heard in father), but it's also not the short A in cat. It's somewhere in between.

Think, something in the lines of this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_front_unrounded_vowel

This is the long/broad A sound that nobody would use for "ana" (unless if they're hardcore Tyari's Lol): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_back_unrounded_vowel

I hope I'm more understood now.  :)

EDIT: Oops, I meant the "a" in the Arabic "anna" is more shorter and "quicker", as in "banner".
« Last Edit: March 10, 2016, 04:02:32 AM by Neon »
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Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2016, 02:38:38 AM »
I think it will be better if this were an audible chat. I can't be so precise on a keyboard.  :) 

Yes, the "a" is more slower (or longer) in Arabic's "anna" (which sounds like "ena" to my ears). It is more like "ah-nah". However, many of us use an unrounded vowel for the "ah" sound. It's kinda of a "short a", but it is still longer than the "a" in cat, if that makes sense? So it's not exactly the broad A (as ubiquitously heard in father), but it's also not the short A in cat. It's somewhere in between. Think, something in the lines of this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_front_unrounded_vowel

This is the long/broad A sound that nobody would use for "ana" (unless if they're hardcore Tyari's Lol): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_back_unrounded_vowel

I hope I'm more understood now.  :)

I do also hear it the way you've just described it. So yes I think it is a valid pronunciation. Nonetheless, I find Assyrians mostly saying it with that broad 'a' sound. I'll send you my Skype username anyway if you want clarify further or participate in making future material.
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Offline Kelba

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2016, 03:09:58 AM »
Cool video :)  Nice work!

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2016, 03:39:14 AM »
Cool video :)  Nice work!

I'd say 'hawit baseema Kelba' but I think 'hawit baseema' will do just fine. :)
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Offline Cascade

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2016, 04:07:27 AM »
I do also hear it the way you've just described it. So yes I think it is a valid pronunciation. Nonetheless, I find Assyrians mostly saying it with that broad 'a' sound. I'll send you my Skype username anyway if you want clarify further or participate in making future material.
I don't have Skype unfortunately, but I would like to see (or hear) more from you. :)

Anyway, I think it depends on the dialect. Urmians do use the more shorter "long" A sound, whilst the rest use a more middle-high vowel. Jilwayehs turn the "a" into an "eh" sound though. I guess we all fall in the Ah-Eh spectrum, somewhere.
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Offline Român

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2016, 09:26:45 PM »
This is amazing...  :yourock:

What you are doing for the community that wants to learn this language is fabulous and I encourage you to continue. I have subscribed, and will watch all videos, hoping to grasp grammar (Verbs, Prepositions, Adjectives, the intensive and causative cases, passive and active as well), although I know a bunch of names for grammar, I have very little time to stay and memorize all of these by reading from a book.

However, if these are done in video format as you are doing, it is easy in our modern society to pull up YouTube on our phones and plug in some earphones.

Thanks a million!
An ethnic Romanian learning Assyrian

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2016, 11:07:35 PM »
This is amazing...  :yourock:

What you are doing for the community that wants to learn this language is fabulous and I encourage you to continue. I have subscribed, and will watch all videos, hoping to grasp grammar (Verbs, Prepositions, Adjectives, the intensive and causative cases, passive and active as well), although I know a bunch of names for grammar, I have very little time to stay and memorize all of these by reading from a book.

However, if these are done in video format as you are doing, it is easy in our modern society to pull up YouTube on our phones and plug in some earphones.

Thanks a million!

Thank you so much Roman!! It takes me a fair amount of time to make these videos; I have to be careful with the content and spend some time planing the video. Nonetheless, I intend on uploading another soon. Thanks for subscribing and for all your support!

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Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #15 on: March 31, 2016, 11:20:07 PM »
how's the channel going khon?

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #16 on: April 01, 2016, 12:22:58 AM »
how's the channel going khon?

Thanks for asking Myuoqra Piper! I've started working on a video to cover conjunctions and prepositions. Even though it's just the basics, I need to make sure I don't miss any of them. Then there are the various dialects...which can bloat the vocabulary or render words ambiguous. Generally, anything in a Syriac dictionary is worth employing so long as it is useful. However, if it is rarely used, then I will try to mention that point.

A big part of me wants to completely rework the language to help it progress but my immediate (and only realistic) goal is to help preserve it. Inbox me if you have free time to help.
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Offline Cascade

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #17 on: April 01, 2016, 12:24:38 AM »
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2016, 03:12:42 AM »
Video number 2 has been released! It concludes the basics of pronouns and linking verbs and shows how linking verbs merge with other words.



Feel free to give feedback!
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Offline Cascade

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2016, 06:12:31 AM »
Better than the first one.

Btw, we say "dula" instead of "haula". In our dialect, we never use "hon" for "hon lakha". We say "dun lakha".
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Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #20 on: May 18, 2016, 06:50:02 AM »
Better than the first one.

Btw, we say "dula" instead of "haula". In our dialect, we never use "hon" for "hon lakha". We say "dun lakha".

I believe it will be more telling if you see how you interpret the words on their own ...for you, what does "hon" mean? And what does "dun" mean? -Most of the time I would interpret the phrase hon laxa as tautology (-Here-I-am, here). Whereas and most of the time, I would interpret "dun laxa" as "I-am here".


The "du-" root is regularly used to mean "is- / am- / are-". However and much less often, the root "du-" is used to express that something is here.

The word "hau" is the exact opposite. It is mostly used to mean here....however and rarely, people use "hau" in the sense of a linking verb root ("hau-") that means "is- / am- / are-"

I'd personally recommend using the most popular usage of both words as apposed to the least popular, for pragmatic and ideal reasons.


I've noticed that it varies a lot between speakers, and I believe the original sense of both words was to convey the sense of something being here/present. Nonetheless, the use of the "du-" root in it's most common form, is very useful for removing ambiguity without relying on tonality. Unfortunately, we do not have a root that does so for the future sense (as far as I know). Personally, I don't really use "hau" much at all and it mainly served as a footnote and a good example of merging words together.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 06:53:57 AM by Sharukinu »
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Offline Joe25

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #21 on: May 18, 2016, 07:09:26 AM »
As a Turoyo speaker myself I still can't understand your dialects but I do like the way it sounds. I'll be following these videos out of pure interest.

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #22 on: May 18, 2016, 08:01:31 AM »
As a Turoyo speaker myself I still can't understand your dialects but I do like the way it sounds. I'll be following these videos out of pure interest.

I am interested in learning Modern Western Syriac Aramaic (Turoyo and Mlahsô) ...after I've properly understood my own dialect which is Modern Eastern Syriac Aramaic (Assyrian Neo Aramaic) :)

Better yet, I'd rather we reform and standardise the language to improve it and so we can all understand each other.
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Offline Cascade

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #23 on: May 18, 2016, 09:04:06 AM »
I believe it will be more telling if you see how you interpret the words on their own ...for you, what does "hon" mean? And what does "dun" mean? -Most of the time I would interpret the phrase hon laxa as tautology (-Here-I-am, here). Whereas and most of the time, I would interpret "dun laxa" as "I-am here".


The "du-" root is regularly used to mean "is- / am- / are-". However and much less often, the root "du-" is used to express that something is here.

The word "hau" is the exact opposite. It is mostly used to mean here....however and rarely, people use "hau" in the sense of a linking verb root ("hau-") that means "is- / am- / are-"

I'd personally recommend using the most popular usage of both words as apposed to the least popular, for pragmatic and ideal reasons.


I've noticed that it varies a lot between speakers, and I believe the original sense of both words was to convey the sense of something being here/present. Nonetheless, the use of the "du-" root in it's most common form, is very useful for removing ambiguity without relying on tonality. Unfortunately, we do not have a root that does so for the future sense (as far as I know). Personally, I don't really use "hau" much at all and it mainly served as a footnote and a good example of merging words together.
I thought "hon" was the way Tyaris say "dun". As in, it's their dialect. Same way they say "hayo" instead of "ta". We just don't use "hon". Iraqi-Koine speakers and Urmians generally don't use "hon-" (unless if they're of Tyari or Barwar background). Instead of "hon", we say "dun" - ("dun lakha", "dun tama", "duna"...).




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Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #24 on: May 18, 2016, 12:03:06 PM »
I thought "hon" was the way Tyaris say "dun". As in, it's their dialect. Same way they say "hayo" instead of "ta". We just don't use "hon". Iraqi-Koine speakers and Urmians generally don't use "hon-" (unless if they're of Tyari or Barwar background). Instead of "hon", we say "dun" - ("dun lakha", "dun tama", "duna"...).

In what sense of "hau"? As a linking verb (am- /is- / are-) or as a word meaning "here"? Even still, Tyaris may use both "hau-" and "hau" the most; and I believe Urmians use "dun-" the most ...but that is all still part of Modern Eastern Syriac Aramaic which is why these terms pass from one tribe to others so smoothly. Each tribe has it's own style but I am trying to animate all our sub-dialects as one solid entity.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 12:04:00 PM by Sharukinu »
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Offline Cascade

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2016, 12:27:16 AM »
In what sense of "hau"? As a linking verb (am- /is- / are-) or as a word meaning "here"?
Both types.

We say "ana dun taya" and/or "duna tama".

We never say "hon tama" or "aya hola thaya".

But I understand your point.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #26 on: May 19, 2016, 02:05:50 AM »
Both types.

We say "ana dun taya" and/or "duna tama".

We never say "hon tama" or "aya hola thaya".

But I understand your point.

I personally use both, though I don't use "hau" much. I'll use anything from any of our dialects so long as it is useful and appropriate.
“It is pleasant, when the sea is high and the winds are dashing the waves about, to watch from the shores the struggles of another.”

― Titus Livy

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: To teach Assyrian, I've made a new channel and new video on YouTube!
« Reply #27 on: July 12, 2016, 05:06:21 AM »
Video number 3 has been released. It covers the basics of nouns regarding their various states that reflect quantity and gender.



As always, feel free to give feedback!
“It is pleasant, when the sea is high and the winds are dashing the waves about, to watch from the shores the struggles of another.”

― Titus Livy

 

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