Author Topic: More foreign words  (Read 1583 times)

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Offline mrzurnaci

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Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2016, 11:52:49 PM »
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2016, 01:21:01 AM »
This one is interesting too:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_loanwords_in_Assyrian_Neo-Aramaic

Wow, alot of it is wrong...

Kursee is from Kursiya which isn't foreign, it's native Aramaic...

Qitta isn't foreign either...

Chappeh is the Kurdish form of Kappeh which is Aramaic.

Gamee is from Turkish, not Kurdish.

Dormanah is an ancient borrowing from Persian to Aramaic.

Goora is Aramaic that Kurds borrowed -_-

Juleh is a modification of Gulleh (cloak)

Hum-mum is from Arabic which is HHmama in Syriac which means the same thing...

Masta is native Aramaic... We freaking invented yogurt...

here's the creator of the Page link you sent me -> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Meganesia

That's either Domanic or you. ° ͜ʖ °

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2016, 01:21:01 AM »

Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2016, 02:51:53 AM »
Wow, alot of it is wrong...

Kursee is from Kursiya which isn't foreign, it's native Aramaic...

Qitta isn't foreign either...

Chappeh is the Kurdish form of Kappeh which is Aramaic.

Gamee is from Turkish, not Kurdish.

Dormanah is an ancient borrowing from Persian to Aramaic.

Goora is Aramaic that Kurds borrowed -_-

Juleh is a modification of Gulleh (cloak)

Hum-mum is from Arabic which is HHmama in Syriac which means the same thing...

Masta is native Aramaic... We freaking invented yogurt...

here's the creator of the Page link you sent me -> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Meganesia

That's either Domanic or you. ° ͜ʖ °
You mean durmana was borrowed by the Persians from us?

I edit anonymously. And I really doubt that it's Domanic.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2016, 03:07:58 AM by Neon »
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline Googoo

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2016, 05:46:09 AM »
We say Masta (with the arabic letter, ط) in our dialect though in Arabic it's rooowb.

Btw, if I went to an Assyrian school in Iraq, will I be taught Classical Syriac or Assyrian? Do Chaldeans use the same alphabet as assyrians? Can you understand their writing?

Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2016, 09:45:49 AM »
We say Masta (with the arabic letter, ط) in our dialect though in Arabic it's rooowb.

Btw, if I went to an Assyrian school in Iraq, will I be taught Classical Syriac or Assyrian? Do Chaldeans use the same alphabet as assyrians? Can you understand their writing?
Yes, Chaldeans use the Assyrian alphabet (Syriac). Like other Assyrians, some of them would use the Estrangela variant (which is more complex) and others would use the Madnhaya (the more basic one).

I think Assyrian schools would normally teach you modern Assyrian.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2016, 01:10:27 PM »
You mean durmana was borrowed by the Persians from us?

I edit anonymously. And I really doubt that it's Domanic.


No. Durmanah is a Persian borrowing.

Durmanah is from (Medieval) Persian "darman" and it was borrowed during the Classical Syriac era as "darmanah"

That's why both modern Persian and Kurdish have it as "darman" and "derman" respectively.

It's essentially a Syriacized Persian word.

The other words meaning drug/medicine is

Samma (we often use it as "poison" because of Arabic influence. Sama in the Arabic sense means poison only but poisons can be used as drugs while drugs themselves can be poisonous if too much is taken)

medkha which has 4 meanings.

    spice
    mixture
    (medicine) remedy, drug
    poison

then there's 'udrana which means help but in the sense of medicine and medical science, it means drug, remedy.

'Ecava (C is Sadhe) which means

    binding, ligature
    bandage, plaster
    healing, curing, recovery
    drug, medicine, medicament, remedy, prescription

deriving from medkha is mudakha which means..

    mixing, mixture, compound, preparation
    (medicine) medicament - drug, remedy
    seasoning, spice, condiment

then there's 'eqqara meaning.

    (botany) root, stump, shoot, sprout, twig
    (medicine) drug, medicinal plant
    herb, weed
    base, foot, lower part
    principle
    origin, stock
    (grammar) root

These 6 words and their meanings are from the legacy of Assyrians having the best available medicine and medical practices of the medieval world and age.

Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2016, 04:28:29 AM »
Is "bassa" or "bas" of Arabic origin?
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2016, 10:08:31 AM »
Is "bassa" or "bas" of Arabic origin?

if you think about it, we have two "bassa/bas".

1 means stop/enough and the 2 means but, then, therefore, yet...

classical syriac uses "kadu"

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%DC%9F%DC%95%DC%98

kadu is a contraction of "kad" meaning "as, when" and "hu" meaning "(it) is"

and it's strangely used the same way "bassa/bas" is.

Offline Googoo

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2016, 10:59:45 AM »
Is "bassa" or "bas" of Arabic origin?

No, it's colloquial arabic  (in the levant and the gulf). In classical arabic, it's kafa or kefaya (enough) depending on where you put it in the sentence or baal (but) (we use it as 'but' and 'enough'). My guess would be that it's a persian word because whoever was under persian rule (Modern day levant,iraq, eastern gulf, egypt, pakistan and some parts of India) do use it whereas north african countries don't since they weren't under persian rule.

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2016, 05:41:56 PM »
No, it's colloquial arabic  (in the levant and the gulf). In classical arabic, it's kafa or kefaya (enough) depending on where you put it in the sentence or baal (but) (we use it as 'but' and 'enough'). My guess would be that it's a persian word because whoever was under persian rule (Modern day levant,iraq, eastern gulf, egypt, pakistan and some parts of India) do use it whereas north african countries don't since they weren't under persian rule.

Nice reasoning :) At which point does a foreign word get naturalised though? Every language borrows from it's neighbours. The Persians occupied our lands a long time ago, and if we've used it for that long, is it an acceptable Assyrian word yet? I suppose these kinds of things are a moot point.
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Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2016, 09:07:20 PM »
if you think about it, we have two "bassa/bas".

1 means stop/enough and the 2 means but, then, therefore, yet...

classical syriac uses "kadu"

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%DC%9F%DC%95%DC%98

kadu is a contraction of "kad" meaning "as, when" and "hu" meaning "(it) is"

and it's strangely used the same way "bassa/bas" is.
Okay, so is saying bas for but "Syriacally correct"?
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline Sharukinu

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2016, 05:20:32 AM »
Okay, so is saying bas for but "Syriacally correct"?

It seems to be a loanword. Maybe Persian (as Googoo was saying). If that is the case, our questions should be: how long have we had it? And, Is it best to consider it a naturalised word?
“It is pleasant, when the sea is high and the winds are dashing the waves about, to watch from the shores the struggles of another.”

― Titus Livy

Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2016, 11:50:15 PM »
It seems to be a loanword. Maybe Persian (as Googoo was saying). If that is the case, our questions should be: how long have we had it? And, Is it best to consider it a naturalised word?
I think it should be a naturalised word. So many of us say "bas". It seems ubiquitous among Iraqi Assyrians. You even hear it in Assyrian songs - And trust me, Assyrian songs are very conservative when it comes to Arabic words (you don't hear those).

I don't think that "bas" is from Farsi. It's most likely a Semitic word.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2016, 01:29:38 AM »
I think it should be a naturalised word. So many of us say "bas". It seems ubiquitous among Iraqi Assyrians. You even hear it in Assyrian songs - And trust me, Assyrian songs are very conservative when it comes to Arabic words (you don't hear those).

I don't think that "bas" is from Farsi. It's most likely a Semitic word.

you realize kadu is used in our church hymns right?...

it's used as  ܟܕ ‎(kaḏ, “as, when”)

does this ring a bell?...

"Ewakh m-homneh hengeh.
Ava, broonah, ruHa d-qudsha hengah
batreyn kyaneh, batreyn qnomeh b-isho msheeHa

bnay madenkha hengah kadhomenon b-isho msheekha"
« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 01:32:59 AM by mrzurnaci »

Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #15 on: March 13, 2016, 03:59:10 AM »
you realize kadu is used in our church hymns right?...

it's used as  ܟܕ ‎(kaḏ, “as, when”)

does this ring a bell?...

"Ewakh m-homneh hengeh.
Ava, broonah, ruHa d-qudsha hengah
batreyn kyaneh, batreyn qnomeh b-isho msheeHa

bnay madenkha hengah kadhomenon b-isho msheekha"
Kad as in "qad"? We use that too, many Assyrians. It has nothing to do with "but".

i.e. "Qad hamasha hamanekh"

It's more like "so" than "but"....
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

Offline mrzurnaci

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #16 on: March 13, 2016, 01:08:31 PM »
Kad as in "qad"? We use that too, many Assyrians. It has nothing to do with "but".

i.e. "Qad hamasha hamanekh"

It's more like "so" than "but"....

no... Kad as in kad...

If I wanted to say "qad" I would've said "qad"...

Offline Cascade

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Re: More foreign words
« Reply #17 on: March 13, 2016, 08:34:55 PM »
no... Kad as in kad...

If I wanted to say "qad" I would've said "qad"...
Okay, I thought you were one of those who didn't know the difference between "Q" and "K".
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. - Charles Darwin

 

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